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drbubb

Colindale - North London: Beaufort Park, etc

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Colindale - North London: Beaufort Park, etc

 

This will be kicked off with excerpts from the "Outside London" thread

 

1/

I think that I "beat" London by my lifestyle living inside London, that gives me a lot of the advantages and very few of the disadvantages.

 

- I live in a nice sleepy suburb that is easy to get into town, yet just a few minutes away from Wimbledon Common and Richmond Park if I feel I need to check out some pretty scenery.

- I live in an nice enough flat, not too big, not too small. It has incredibly low heating and running costs, and I live in the cheapest council tax borough in the country.

- I work locally, as does my wife. We avoid the stress of commuting in centrally every day, and the extra time we save is worth a lot to us.

- I cycle everywhere.

 

013_beaufort_park1-464x310.jpg

Beaufort Park, Hendon

 

Yesterday, we visited the Colindale area, in Hendon -

Which and looked at some new properties within easy walking distance of Colindale Tube (Northern Line)

 

We reckon we can buy a nice new property, with good spec at something like GBP 350-450 psf,

and that would suit us much better than buying at GBP 800-1000 in Central London.

 

That particular branch of the Northern line runs through Hampstead and Camden Town, and is now running more efficiently than I can remember from my prior time in London - it makes some good West End (Leicester Sq) and City (Bank St) connections

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2/

Dull ?

I moved from central London to Hertfordshre in 2002 and cashed in, not expecting London prices to go ballistic. Error 1- me too, I had a flat in Shoreditch and moved to the Highlands for two years near Aviemore - councils more clued up on severe weather.

. . .

My sister lived in Colindale - it's possibly the dullest part of London you could live in.

LOL

That may have been the case.

I think the new developments may be beginning to change that.... Slowly, slowly

Of course, alot depends on where your friends live, and how you like to spend your time

 

But... until now: No high street, No cinema, Not many interesting restaurants.

The easy Tube journey down to the West End is the saving grace right now

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3/

Looked at beaufort park and decided against because the rooms were tiny at the prices they were asking; there's a £1200 service charge and £200 ground rent I think which includes gym use.

 

Anyone looked into getting a bluegen boiler? Supposedly the cost of these was too come down to more reasonable levels and certainly a better alternative to solar.

 

" the rooms were tiny at the prices they were asking"

 

I would argue that you need to become more sophisticated, like HK property buyers

and learn to focus on the Price per sf

 

It is about GBP 400 - 450 psf, depending on the flat, That is high for the area, and far below

Central London's prices of 800- 1000 or higher. How much of a savings do you need to justify the extra travel time?

 

The Colindale area is gentrifying fast, and so iy may be worth it - but there;s plenty of fresh suplly coming at B-Park

 

Sorry to use one of your own phrases on you, but I think you should be a little careful here. I know the nw London property market very well and these properties look very overpriced to me. They are only selling to people from outside the area.

 

Sure,

The buyers care about the time from those properties to certain destinations in central London,

and having a certain style and standard around them.

 

Tell me something else that is nice in the local area, and I may have a look. Something near to BP, which has access to the restaurants and shops in that development, and is significantly cheaper on a per sf basis, might be attractive.

 

image-from-developers.jpg

 

( Beaufort Park was an interesting site, especially the area and the developments response to some of the challenges of the site in terms of block size, historical buildings, and nearby land uses. It will be interesting to see how a high density development works within the Colindale area especially with the transportation network. / Read on to see what we saw…. )

 

Berkeley may have spotted a genuine opportunity, represented by a large buildable area - large enough to create a nice micro environment, where the land was priced low enough, to allow them to make a decent income in selling the Beaufort Park flats at above-local-pricing.

 

This is a pattern that you are likely to see repeated as Crossrail gets built, and other areas are brought within shorter commuting times near Central London

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That's fair enough, but in order for an area to gentrify it needs to attract a lot of local owner occupiers rather than overseas investors and btl landlords. If I wanted to live in this area, then for that budget I could buy a solidly built 1930s semi on the nice side of colindale. The transport connections are slightly better, plus you get a tree lined street, a reasonable choice of shops and schools, and most importantly the area is much safer at night.

 

London is very unusual in one regard in that social and low cost housing is distributed throughout the city. As long as there is social mobility this is an admirable policy unfortunately in practice this now means you can walk from a prosperous safe area to a poor dangerous area in just 5 minutes. Many of the new builds in London suburbs are going up in the latter, because that's where the empty land is. For example, the BP development borders one of the largest council estates in SE England, but the agents will never tell you that. Of course some could gentrify, but given the area, the lack of amenities, the high density, the erratic build construction, and the current lack of owner occupiers there is a real danger some of these estates will be slums in 20 years.

&

I realise I didn't answer your direct question, but I don't think I can. Directly east of BP, on the other side of the A41, you can buy a house for the same money. However for me you you still have one big problem, which is that the walk from the station to BP is unsafe, and your partner will not be happy to make this journey alone after dark.

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"the walk from the station to BP is unsafe, and your partner will not be happy to make this journey alone after dark."

 

An interesting point.

The easy fix would be to improve the lighting, and that may happen as more people move into BP and complain about the dark walkway.

 

Another solution might be to buy at Pulse, which is a cheaper and somewhat lower build property, which is right next to the station.

 

I hear that there are plans to rebuild the station at Colindale, and that may come with some better lighting as well.

 

For a comparison, I today visited Dickens Yard which is in Ealing, and it is from the same developer, St George, It is of a slightly higher standard, but not that much different. And if the average price at Beaufort Park is GBP 400-450 (mid-425), then at DY it is GBP 650-750 (mid-700- that's 64.7%) higher.

 

How do they justify that?

 

Well, Ealing has a nice high street, and the developers say that DY will have some high end retail on a special internal street that is being created. But are these things really worth the 65% extra money? Maybe - but perhaps not to me -that's a big difference, and Ealing is far from Central London, a consideration for me. The sales people at DY say most of the buyers at their development are English rather than foreign. So if you bet on Colindale, then you are betting that foreign buyers have a better eye for value than those who live near ....

 

Ealing is a much "nicer" area than Colindale, but this also looks overpriced to me. Most new build in London is priced at a 20-30% premium against comparable older property. If buyers know this, and have their own reasons for paying the premium then fair enough. Do they know though? The sales literature on new build often is misleading, particularly on location, which makes accurate comparison difficult. Also, rooms sizes of new build are often v small, and uk buyers from outside London are not used to £psf calculations.

DrBubb, I don't know all your motivations for looking at London property, so excuse me if this is out of turn. However if you have a budget of £350-400k, then for this money you can buy a small 2 bed in Hampstead Garden Suburb, or a slightly larger apartment in Golders Green, Hendon, or Finchley. All these areas have better transport links, restaurants, shops and parks than either Colindale or Ealing.

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"if you have a budget of £350-400k, then for this money you can buy a small 2 bed in Hampstead Garden Suburb, or a slightly larger apartment in Golders Green, Hendon, or Finchley. All these areas have better transport links, restaurants, shops and parks than either Colindale or Ealing"

 

Driving through it the other day, I would also say: Mill Hill's not bad

 

The New properties give an idea where an area is headed, I think.

Obviously, if one has time to look thoroughly, secondhand can be far cheaper.

My partner likes looking at new properties, and we have seen many marketed in HK, and wondered what their local areas looked like.

That's what led us to Colindale

 

I'm told Mill Hill is a very pleasant place to live. I believe the station is on the Thameslink Line, which is a little slow and infrequent. If this line is upgraded this could be a big boost.

Yes.

I also heard that the train frequency is not good - and Mill Hill East (on the Tube line) is a bit far from the high street

 

For Colindale to compete with these other areas, then some more shopping and other facilities would need to develop around Beaufort Park

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How about Crossrail stations outside central London = places like Hayes, for instance.?

(or maybe even to the East, where prices are still lower)

 

Do you think the reality of Crossrail is still too far away?

Dickens Yard at Ealing, has been using CR as a talking point in their discussions with buyers.

(And I would say it is already priced-in at what they are asking there)

 

Strewth Bubb

You'll end up being my neighbour...

 

Colindale? Hayes?

 

Are you thinking straight?

 

Hayes is a place without a purpose. Best thing you could do is level it and start again.

 

Colindale is like belly button lint. And the entire Burnt Oak broadway is getting rougher by the minute.

 

Even with spillover, investment potential...Gaaak

 

I won't be buying in the UK now.

 

I had a good look around, and I think it is all overpriced.

(Places like Chichester looked interesting, and maybe cheap enough for what they offer, but I don't want to live on the coast just now.)

 

The basic idea has been to SELL IN HONG KONG, and buy the same or better lifestyle at a lower price overseas.

After a thorough look, I don't think the UK is the best place for me to seek an alternative. In fact, this did not surprise me - I expected to find that - but I wanted to have a thorough look, in case I was missing something. Now I am more confident that there are not cheap, but highly livable pockets of the UK, just waiting for me to spot them.

 

North America (the US or Canada) should be cheaper.

. . .

Also, the thread is not only for me.

I think these types of price relationships should be of great interest to anyone who lives near or in the Greater London area. Those GBP 1,000 psf prices may provide a wonderful selling window. And you need not move into rental accomodation. You can sell out and "downsize" into something far cheaper, pocketing the difference.

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I discovered that there is a thread on HPC, called :

Beaufort Park Hendon ( Colindale )

 

And it was started back in 2008, it it provides some historical perspective on topics in this thread.

I have to say, it did not start out very favorable on Colindale, or Beaufort Park -

but I do know that British people like to slag off places with a bad reputation:

 

1/

There is a new development of 3500 new flats in Colindale, but they are saying Hendon.

 

http://www.beaufortp...cfm?articleID=2

 

2 years ago during building it burnt down and after being rebuilt it is almost complete. The local estate agents are selling 1 bed flats for about 250k!!! and in some instances more, the penthouses are on the market for 700k.

 

I know the 1 bed flats sold off plan for about 200k.

The place looks deserted, the area is not so good, in fact just opposite Graham Park.

 

I cant see them selling all 3500 flats, they are renting 1 bed studios for about 950 per month.

Do you think this Beaufort Park place will just fill up with dole people?

- everybody's friend

 

2/

The only good thing about the location is that it is close to Barnet Police Headquarters and Hendon Training College to try to deter some of the criminal lowlife from Graham Park robbing your houses.

 

Graham Park is truly nasty. I cant believe that they would think that people would pay those sorts of prices to live there.

 

I like the website saying how many town centres there are in Barnet for shopping. Considering that amongst their closest would be Burnt Oak and Colindale, I wouldnt be boasting about that!

- The Conveyancer

 

 

3/ (there was a positive comment):

16 June 2008 - 08:37 PM

I live in this so called training ground for criminals.....It's nice, fully occupied, and as a 28 year old female I've walked back from the tube many many many times in the dark, yes even drunk, and as yet I have not felt threatened at all. In fact, I have even been offered an escort home on one occasion- and before you ask, yes I did accept, no I didn't get attacked or robbed, and there are still good people in the world.

 

If any of you doom sayers did your homework, you'd know that they are knocking down and rebuilding Graham Park over the next 10 years (started already) with only 30% remaining as social housing. Think what you like about that as a social policy, but the old disaster that is Graham Park is on its last legs.

- Lightbulb Lucy

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Berkeley may have spotted a genuine opportunity, represented by a large buildable area - large enough to create a nice micro environment, where the land was priced low enough, to allow them to make a decent income in selling the Beaufort Park flats at above-local-pricing.

 

This is a pattern that you are likely to see repeated as Crossrail gets built, and other areas are brought within shorter commuting times near Central London

 

Bubb would be interested in your opinion of possible impact of CROSSRAIL on UK/London property prices, if we can ignore the bear case for UK property - which we are both aware of!. Crossrail is half built so the Gov cannot back out of it now.

 

Not sure myself what to think of the likely impact on the outer east ie ESSEX area. Could well go up but property there is hardly bargain territory in global terms. Areas on the Crossrail stops are half decent (ie not obvious urban regeneration areas) therefore might appeal to those with more cash?? (which in UK property terms rules me out LOL).

 

Maryland is one stop, just next to Stratford which might appeal to bargain hunters. As might Manor Park - which is fairly cheap simply because it is a nightmare to drive in / out of!!

 

 

http://www.crossrail...property-values

 

report talks of a £5.5bn boost to uk property values !!

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Bubb would be interested in your opinion of possible impact of CROSSRAIL on UK/London property prices, if we can ignore the bear case for UK property - which we are both aware of!. Crossrail is half built so the Gov cannot back out of it now.

 

Not sure myself what to think of the likely impact on the outer east ie ESSEX area. Could well go up but property there is hardly bargain territory in global terms. Areas on the Crossrail stops are half decent (ie not obvious urban regeneration areas) therefore might appeal to those with more cash?? (which in UK property terms rules me out LOL).

 

Maryland is one stop, just next to Stratford which might appeal to bargain hunters.

As might Manor Park - which is fairly cheap simply because it is a nightmare to drive in / out of!!

 

http://www.crossrail...property-values

 

report talks of a £5.5bn boost to uk property values !!

 

That's a big jump in values!

Crossrail may help parts of London to retain or gain value in period of sliding values in Greater London.

 

I looked at this closely a few months ago:

http://www.greenenergyinvestors.com/index.php?showtopic=16838

 

And found some opportunities, but when I asked myself: Do you really want to live there?

My usual answer for these places was : Not yet.

I suppose most people will wait for the links to be in place, and some signs of gentrification,

before they will jump on the bandwagon.

 

Maybe the thing to do is invest there, but not yet live there. But London is too far away for me to do that now.

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Beautiful downtown Colindale

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96nJ3S7fqeA

 

Here's Beaufort Park itself:

 

Flat / Apartment for sale in London for £155,000 (a studio)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Nfa9NlYEo8

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