Steve Netwriter Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Bill, WGC & Nadler: enemy combatants There used to be a guy in the town where I grew up who seemed decent enough, but had this one incredibly annoying habit. He would cheerfully greet you, then immediately bust his butt to tell you about all of the sorrow and misery of the local town folk. He would eagerly inform you of who contracted cancer, or which wife left her husband, or whose nephew just got killed in a fatal auto accident. I think he enjoyed being the bearer of bad news. It seemed the worse the tragedy the happier he was to tell you. After thoroughly depressing you he would then depart with some inane remark about the weather. As I got older I learned to avoid him. I didn't want to know the sorrow and misery of people I barely knew. I think that just about sums up what Jon Nadler is all about. He cheerfully greets you, delivers depressing gold news, then leaves you with his trite "happy trading". The World Gold Council once again shoots the gold industry in the foot http://www.commodityonline.com/news/topsto...ils.php?id=8534 and Jon Nadler is ecstatic. He gleefully reports on their amazing load of garbage. It is beyond comprehension how people (alleging to be) representing gold's interest do everything in their power to discredit gold. This is no accident, and time will be the ultimate judge of their fraudulent propaganda. The WGC and Nadler seem to be talking up a SHORT position in gold, not a long position. There is no way you would say these idiot things if you were long gold, or heavily invested. Once again the silence from the mines who support the WGC is deafening. Anybody invested in these mines should be flabbergasted. Thank God I'm not invested in them. GFMS, WGC, CPM Group, Virtual Metals, Jon Nadler, and Jeffrey Christian are enemy combatants; traitors to the cause of free gold. They are more insidious than mainstream media because they cloak as pro-gold organizations. Unfortunately for them the economic winds are shifting. It's getting harder to deny the conspiracy to hide inflation, and suppress gold. Now even Paul Farrel of CBS MarketWatch says government statistics and data are nothing more than one big fraud, meant to mask true inflation and hide how terrible the economy truly is. Sound familiar? Megabubble waiting for new president in 2009 'Numbers racket' exposes potential disaster for economy, markets MarketWatch Better order a tin foil hat for Paul Farrel. Pretty soon Nadler is going to have to pass out a couple million of them. So many reasons for Jon to slink away, so little time. If my hometown is any indication people will someday walk 3 blocks out of their way to avoid him. James Mc http://www.lemetropolecafe.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Oil through $130. Congrats, everyone! Especially to the Fed and the BoE who took their printing presses to the absolute limit to achieve this fantastic goal. I am looking forward to $150 and then soon $200. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 GFMS, WGC, CPM Group, Virtual Metals, Jon Nadler, and Jeffrey Christian are enemy combatants; traitors to the cause of free gold. They are more insidious than mainstream media because they cloak as pro-gold organizations. Unfortunately for them the economic winds are shifting. It's getting harder to deny the conspiracy to hide inflation, and suppress gold. Fabulous paranoia - up there with "reds under the bed". Does the guy think that true goldbugs speak no evil of gold under any circumstances? The WGC report seems pretty bleeding obvious to me - we've had a bull run as high demand has pushed the price up - at this stage it seems reasonable that demand (other than pure speculative demand) may be suppressed by higher prices and weakening economic conditions. Unfortunately for them the economic winds are shifting. It's getting harder to deny the conspiracy to hide inflation, and suppress gold. There is probably a government attempt to deny the level of inflation - it is not identical with an attempt to suppress gold, and suppressing gold isn't the reason for denying inflation. Funny how too narrow a focus on one issue can make people appear completely mad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 ...pure speculative demand... Investment demand and safety buying? There is probably a government attempt to deny the level of inflation - it is not identical with an attempt to suppress gold, and suppressing gold isn't the reason for denying inflation. ... I think one of the main reasons why the price of gold is getting heavily managed every now and then is to make the USD look good. A weak USD means prices go up, hence inflation. Regarding gold suppression, much of it is mere stupidity. Take the "Brown Bottom". I don't think it was a manipulation attempt. I think it was stupidity and ignorance in its purest form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Gold, silver, oil, the EUR, etc. -- all up in the green today. EXCEPT for GBP. Sterling = Turdling. It's so sad. But what can you expect from a currency that is mostly backed by itself, USD, and Northern Rock subprime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Investment demand and safety buying? More or less the same thing - except if you're buying in the belief that civilisation will collapse, you're buying because you believe or hope the future price rises will be higher than alternatives. Personally I see it as speculation rather than investment as I define investment in the old-fashioned sense as putting money into a project or company to support it in creating wealth. All you do with gold is buy it, hoard it and wait. Regarding gold suppression, much of it is mere stupidity. Take the "Brown Bottom". I don't think it was a manipulation attempt. I think it was stupidity and ignorance in its purest form. Sounds about right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 More or less the same thing - except if you're buying in the belief that civilisation will collapse, you're buying because you believe or hope the future price rises will be higher than alternatives. Personally I see it as speculation rather than investment as I define investment in the old-fashioned sense as putting money into a project or company to support it in creating wealth. All you do with gold is buy it, hoard it and wait. ... Let's call it wealth preservation in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Let's call it wealth preservation in this case. If the prediction that gold beats inflation (and other alternatives) is correct then it's wealth preservation. If not I guess it's a gamble that didn't pay off. You're confident of the former outcome - you could certainly say that the intention is wealth preservation, but until that can be seen in retrospect one can't be sure if it's a winning bet or a losing bet, which kind of takes me back to the 'speculation' word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixel8r Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 If the prediction that gold beats inflation (and other alternatives) is correct then it's wealth preservation. If not I guess it's a gamble that didn't pay off. You're confident of the former outcome - you could certainly say that the intention is wealth preservation, but until that can be seen in retrospect one can't be sure if it's a winning bet or a losing bet, which kind of takes me back to the 'speculation' word. I believe it to be more insurance than speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 I believe it to be more insurance than speculation. I'll give you that one - since it might not protect your wealth in all scenarios, but in the ones that you are using it as insurance against, it will probably pay out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itinerant Wanderer Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Two pronged warning of imminent Gold price correction: - I upped my long position today - my broker displays the following add on its login page - Commodities Seminars – London, Birmingham and Manchester Learn how to access commodities with Société Générale covered warrants, listed products and Lyxor ETFs. Find out more > Does the latter sound familiar? CS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 ... Does the latter sound familiar? ... I guess we're finally seeing the commodities boom going public. Another ten years to go then, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kernull Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 EDIT: With WTI crude oil at $129, gold could be at $1,900 without being more expensive than historical average since 1946. you guys forget one thing. In the 1970s we didn't had food crisis , now we have one. and energy crisis. if in 1970s gold was competing only agaisnt inflation problem, today it competes against inflation, energy and agriculture. 1900 * 66% = 1,254/oz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobsta Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 I'm certainly getting more bullish as time goes on, but I'm still 90% convinced we're going to get an eye-watering sell day before we start a sustainable uptrend. Where that sell takes us is the important thing, if the bears wait much longer I can't see it even getting to $850 to be honest, hence my comment that they were running out of time. I've waited patiently and avoided a fair few sell offs over the past month or so and I'm now confident that we are close enough to the end of this correction that I'm prepared to start adding to my core positions. I'm just doing it very slowly to avoid getting caught out by that monster drop I think is coming. So Marceau, did you manage to load up in good time? I'd be interested to know your thoughts on the past week's trading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 you guys forget one thing. In the 1970s we didn't had food crisis , now we have one. and energy crisis. if in 1970s gold was competing only agaisnt inflation problem, today it competes against inflation, energy and agriculture. 1900 * 66% = 1,254/oz Not quite sure about this. The 70s saw the oil (=energy) crisis. What did food stuff do back then? No inflation in food during the 70s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azazel Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 It really seems to be making steady progress. I want to make some profit so I would be grateful for any insight into any coming pull back. JS thinks we will nearly get to 1000 before falling back for another attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 It really seems to be making steady progress. I want to make some profit so I would be grateful for any insight into any coming pull back. JS thinks we will nearly get to 1000 before falling back for another attempt. That's my gut feeling too. A major drop in oil from somewhere could slow the processes as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Netwriter Posted May 22, 2008 Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 Oil $134 Warning over volatile oil prices By Edmund Conway Economics Editor Last Updated: 12:14am BST 22/05/2008 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtm...22/cnoil122.xml Sky-high volatile prices in oil, food and a swath of minerals are now a permanent feature of the economy, a Nobel prize-winning economist has warned as crude touched a new record peak. Michael Spence of Stanford University warned that volatile commodity prices were perennial features of the modern economy, but were "worth suffering". It came as crude prices hit a new record high, rising above $132 a barrel. In a further sign that investors are betting on prices staying high well into the future, the cost of buying a barrel of oil for delivery in 2016 rose briefly above $142. In London, Brent crude was up $4.28 at a record $132.12 in late trading. Analysts said yesterday that the rise in the oil price was down to a cocktail of factors, including strong demand from emerging economies and poor production performance by oil cartel Opec. However, in an unusual statement, the Bank of England dismissed claims that the recent spike in crude prices was due to speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Netwriter Posted May 22, 2008 Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 An excellent and long interview with James Turk of Gold Money: James Turk on Gold: The Ultimate Inflation and Catastrophe Hedge May 21, 2008 http://seekingalpha.com/article/78214-jame...dge?source=feed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kernull Posted May 22, 2008 Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 Not quite sure about this. The 70s saw the oil (=energy) crisis. What did food stuff do back then? No inflation in food during the 70s? I mean, there there were a lot of oil and it was cheap. The rising prices in oil and food during 70s were due to inflation only, now they are rising because of oil depletion. I agree that "now is different" is not likely, but only for inflation factor, not the oil depletion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted May 22, 2008 Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 I mean, there there were a lot of oil and it was cheap. The rising prices in oil and food during 70s were due to inflation only, now they are rising because of oil depletion. I agree that "now is different" is not likely, but only for inflation factor, not the oil depletion. Exactly, I've said it before, but there are perfectly good reasons to think oil should be trading at a higher relative price than in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 Was there some physical dumping in London today? Spain selling more of its silver (or in this case: gold) again? Who of the Club Med will give in first? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 I mean, there there were a lot of oil and it was cheap. The rising prices in oil and food during 70s were due to inflation only, now they are rising because of oil depletion. I agree that "now is different" is not likely, but only for inflation factor, not the oil depletion. Yes, we have sort of peak everything. Gold and silver are good examples with gold production going down over the past years (I think more than oil). Has anyone the numbers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted May 22, 2008 Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 Yes, we have sort of peak everything. Gold and silver are good examples with gold production going down over the past years (I think more than oil). Has anyone the numbers? 1) Gold being mined is only a small proportion of the market as opposed to oil where new oil is the whole market. So production costs are far more relevant to oil. 2) The prospect of gold depletion is of no great importance - there will still be gold around even if we mine it all. Oil on the other hand is burned and is of huge importance to the world economy as it currently operates. Guess which one is more likely to have its price affected by peak/depletion issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted May 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 What's the deflationistas take on $135 oil? Will we have 'deflation' to $120 soon? Hmm, that would scare me, really. :lol: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...&refer=home OPEC has ``no magic solution'' to record crude prices, Qatar's oil minister said. OPEC losers. The US has a solution: print more money and then buy more oil! Easy really. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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