Suggestions from loyal GEI-ers about the site's direction

[G0ldfinger]

The USA manufacturers more things than any other country on earth

They're certainly world-leading in fabricating toxic OTC derivatives.

[HPCsoYESTERDAY]

Like all other currencies, Sterling got only off the Golddollar standard in 1971. Not sure why Bubb ignores the most simple facts like this.

 

i.e. because countries could exchange their $ for gold, as France had done prior to this?

[G0ldfinger]

i.e. because countries could exchange their $ for gold, as France had done prior to this?

Yes, of course. So no reason to conveniently ignore this fact.

 

We've only been on a fiat system since 1971 - not much time, and who said the average fiat currency lasts 40 years?

 

Hoh-ho-ho!

[lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)]

Like all other currencies, Sterling got only off the Golddollar standard in 1971. Not sure why Bubb ignores the most simple facts like this.

maybe because he is an ex banker and enjoys the casino of fiat money

 

and yep 40 years we are getting close

[drbubb]

Like all other currencies, Sterling got only off the Golddollar standard in 1971. Not sure why Bubb ignores the most simple facts like this.

\

So for how much of its 900 year history, was Sterling on a gold standard?

 

I think any gold bug who says that "over time all fiat currencies go to zero",

simply hasnt done his homework.

 

Show I really care, if currencies can last so many lifetimes?

Isnt it better to understand the forces that drive currency depreciation and appreciation,

rather than just relying on sound bites, that the long existence of Sterling prove to be false?

 

[BlackPepper]

Gold is the best thing to hold in both inflation and deflation - so no issues really.

hahhahhahahahaha..................hahahaahhahaahahha hahhahahhhaha

oh hahahhahahahahahaah

 

[Jake]

\

So for how much of its 900 year history, was Sterling on a gold standard?

 

I think any gold bug who says that "over time all fiat currencies go to zero",

simply hasnt done his homework.

 

Show I really care, if currencies can last so many lifetimes?

Isnt it better to understand the forces that drive currency depreciation and appreciation,

rather than just relying on sound bites, that the long existence of Sterling prove to be false?

 

 

Sterling had been on a gold or silver standard for most of its history. That is why it lasted so long, surely?

[G0ldfinger]

Sterling had been on a gold or silver standard for most of its history. That is why it lasted so long, surely?

People have been so lulled in by the paper banksters, they don't even know the most simple facts anymore. Inflations came usually during war times and temporary loss of convertibility.

[lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)]

People have been so lulled in by the paper banksters, they don't even know the most simple facts anymore. Inflations came usually during war times and temporary loss of convertibility.

even quite intelligent ones

 

 

[wren]

So for how much of its 900 year history, was Sterling on a gold standard?

 

...

In Anglo-Saxon times a pound was a pound of silver, although I think that pound was somewhat smaller than the modern pound weight.

 

In 1909 (100 years ago) a pound Sterling was one gold sovereign which today probably costs over 150 "pounds".

 

The pound of today seems not to be the same thing even though it has the same name.

[lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)]

The pound of today seems not to be the same thing even though it has the same name.

 

Yep

 

but those in charge of the system have done a good job fooling most that the currency has lasted a long time

 

or maybe its because most people dont think

[id5]

So for how much of its 900 year history, was Sterling on a gold standard?

 

I think any gold bug who says that "over time all fiat currencies go to zero",

simply hasnt done his homework.

 

Show I really care, if currencies can last so many lifetimes?

Isnt it better to understand the forces that drive currency depreciation and appreciation,

rather than just relying on sound bites, that the long existence of Sterling prove to be false?

Wren is correct in his earlier post in that a modern pound is heavier than one in Anglo-Saxon times but the origin of the pound and its division into 12 parts was from Rome and brought into Britain as Celtic and Roman coinage before their invasion. The use of the name Sterling appeared between the 11th and 13th centuries but the start of Sterling as a currency is often attributed to the Henry II re-coinage in 1158. Foreign gold was used and gold coin was previously last minted in Britain in the 8th century but was minted again until 1344.

 

But whilst gold coin was used the exchange rate between silver and gold floated free. In 1717 the Kingdom of Great Britain (it wasn’t the UK until 1800) defined the value of its silver currency in gold and fixed the rate of exchange rate between the two but a true international gold standard did not happen until Germany pegged its gold/silver exchange rate to that of Great Britain in 1873 after the Franco-Prussian War. WWI removed the UK from the gold standard for 11 years from 1914 to 1925 and the Depression along with WWII did the same from 1931 till 1939 and 1939 to 1946, another 15 years. Post WWII the gold standard ran until 1971.

 

So the answer Dr. B. is, of the 851 years of Sterling’s history only 72 years have been on the gold standard.

 

[HPCsoYESTERDAY]

Wren is correct in his earlier post in that a modern pound is heavier than one in Anglo-Saxon times but the origin of the pound and its division into 12 parts was from Rome and brought into Britain as Celtic and Roman coinage before their invasion. The use of the name Sterling appeared between the 11th and 13th centuries but the start of Sterling as a currency is often attributed to the Henry II re-coinage in 1158. Foreign gold was used and gold coin was previously last minted in Britain in the 8th century but was minted again until 1344.

 

But whilst gold coin was used the exchange rate between silver and gold floated free. In 1717 the Kingdom of Great Britain (it wasn’t the UK until 1800) defined the value of its silver currency in gold and fixed the rate of exchange rate between the two but a true international gold standard did not happen until Germany pegged its gold/silver exchange rate to that of Great Britain in 1873 after the Franco-Prussian War. WWI removed the UK from the gold standard for 11 years from 1914 to 1925 and the Depression along with WWII did the same from 1931 till 1939 and 1939 to 1946, another 15 years. Post WWII the gold standard ran until 1971.

 

So the answer Dr. B. is, of the 851 years of Sterling’s history only 72 years have been on the gold standard.

 

a very informative post id

 

personally speaking, i think that the relative small time that the 'gold standard' existed seems to undermine the fact that silver and gold were used in UK/GB coinage for over 2 millennia

[drbubb]

In Anglo-Saxon times a pound was a pound of silver, although I think that pound was somewhat smaller than the modern pound weight.

 

In 1909 (100 years ago) a pound Sterling was one gold sovereign which today probably costs over 150 "pounds".

 

The pound of today seems not to be the same thing even though it has the same name.

hmmm

Maybe GF could show UK house prices measured in Pounds of silver

 

[Icarus]

Wren is correct in his earlier post in that a modern pound is heavier than one in Anglo-Saxon times but the origin of the pound and its division into 12 parts was from Rome and brought into Britain as Celtic and Roman coinage before their invasion. The use of the name Sterling appeared between the 11th and 13th centuries but the start of Sterling as a currency is often attributed to the Henry II re-coinage in 1158. Foreign gold was used and gold coin was previously last minted in Britain in the 8th century but was minted again until 1344.

 

But whilst gold coin was used the exchange rate between silver and gold floated free. In 1717 the Kingdom of Great Britain (it wasn’t the UK until 1800) defined the value of its silver currency in gold and fixed the rate of exchange rate between the two but a true international gold standard did not happen until Germany pegged its gold/silver exchange rate to that of Great Britain in 1873 after the Franco-Prussian War. WWI removed the UK from the gold standard for 11 years from 1914 to 1925 and the Depression along with WWII did the same from 1931 till 1939 and 1939 to 1946, another 15 years. Post WWII the gold standard ran until 1971.

 

So the answer Dr. B. is, of the 851 years of Sterling’s history only 72 years have been on the gold standard.

 

And a penny was 1/240 of a troy pound of silver. I've been led to believe that this was based on the Roman denarii, hence a penny was 1d. Can't remember where I read about this though, sorry.

 

[InternationalRockSuperstar]

The pound of today seems not to be the same thing even though it has the same name.

 

the pound of today is not bound by or defined by reality in any way.

 

Sterling is the World's 4th reserve currency (f*** knows why) and apparently HMG owes the rest of the World a squillion pounds, but what's to stop them just printing a one squillion pound note and handing it to them?

 

[G0ldfinger]

hmmm

Maybe GF could show UK house prices measured in Pounds of silver

It has been there all this time (in ounces, but that doesn't make a difference anyway).

 

http://gold.approximity.com/since1930/UK_H..._Silver_LOG.png

 

http://gold.approximity.com/since1930/UK_H...s_in_Silver.png

[G0ldfinger]

personally speaking, i think that the relative small time that the 'gold standard' existed seems to undermine the fact that silver and gold were used in UK/GB coinage for over 2 millennia

I would not say 'undermine'. I think it's simply some rethoric paper bugs try to use to blurr the fact that for (possibly much more than) 2,000 years, and only except for the last 38 years(!), Britain has used gold and silver as money.

 

EDIT: As I've said many times before, it would possibly be more appropriate to call me Silverfinger anyway.

[id5]

And a penny was 1/240 of a troy pound of silver. I've been led to believe that this was based on the Roman denarii, hence a penny was 1d. Can't remember where I read about this though, sorry.

It was King Pepin the Short that decided on the standard and his son Charlemagne instituted it across Europe and it was based on the on a penny being 1/240 of a pound of silver and 1/12 of a shilling but at the time a pound weighed about 325g, not a troy pound.

 

The division by 240 is more complex but originally comes from the city states of Sumer, in what is now southern Iraq, where they began using base 60 math between the 4th and 3rd millennium BC, it is an easy method of counting 6’s with a pair of hands and fractional math is simple if you have not been exposed to the decimal point. Europe did not use base 10 math and decimal points until the 12th century and the UK not until the decimalisation of currency in the 1971. So Pepin just followed the Roman (Sumerian) way and divided a pound using base 60 and that is how the UK now has pounds, shillings and pence.

 

[id5]

I would not say 'undermine'. I think it's simply some rethoric paper bugs try to use to blurr the fact that for (possibly much more than) 2,000 years, and only except for the last 38 years(!), Britain has used gold and silver as money.

...

You are right GF, the earliest coinage to be found in Britain was made from gold, silver and copper and these metals have been used as coinage throughout its history. Even in the last 38 years gold coins have been produced, it is only custom that has stopped people from using them in shops because their value has floated free of the ‘Gold Standard’ and its people too dumbed down to understand the relative values.

[Member100]

Do you miss the FOPPs?

 

There was a time years ago that people called me a FOP.

I changed my style. And I dont see myself that way at all

[drbubb]

It was King Pepin the Short that decided on the standard and his son Charlemagne instituted it across Europe and it was based on the on a penny being 1/240 of a pound of silver and 1/12 of a shilling but at the time a pound weighed about 325g, not a troy pound.

 

The division by 240 is more complex but originally comes from the city states of Sumer, in what is now southern Iraq, where they began using base 60 math between the 4th and 3rd millennium BC, it is an easy method of counting 6’s with a pair of hands and fractional math is simple if you have not been exposed to the decimal point. Europe did not use base 10 math and decimal points until the 12th century and the UK not until the decimalisation of currency in the 1971. So Pepin just followed the Roman (Sumerian) way and divided a pound using base 60 and that is how the UK now has pounds, shillings and pence.

Here's another reall great chart from Goldfinger showing House prices in ounces of Silver

 

I'm going to ponder on that long period of stability 1930-70, with prices at 5,000-10,000 oz.

when I presume that there was some rise in UK population

[drbubb]

(this thread is being moved to the "About GEI" section)