narrowescape

Yes, but transferring your trust to the auditors still leaves you with the same problem. If you don't hold it, you don't own it - brutally simple but true as it ever was.

 

It is extremely tempting to go the easy route of digits on a screen representing bullion which can be swapped for fiat digits at the click of a mouse but giving in to that temptation has consequences...

^^ What he said

While gold in your possession can be lost or stolen if you're careless or unlucky, if that happens it is your fault, and should some one try to steal it you at least have the opportunity of defending yourself against such an attack. A piece of paper claiming ownership is not the same as ownership. All it takes is a letter to revoke that ownership and there is pretty much sod all you can do about it. Possession, 9/10 ths and all that...

That is a huge reason for anyone in the uk to buy physical sovs.

But i would'nt be suprised to see the tax exemption removed and even applied retrospectively.

They will be trying to squeeze tax out of every orifice likely to yield any as we move forward you can see it happening already in various sectors dont become soft easy picking's for these criminals.

TAKE POSSESION AND SECURE IT YOURSELF.!!!

Do you know of any retrospectve tax laws? The current law is that any gold that is UK currency at the time of sale or purchase (i.e sovs or brits) is exempt from CGT at the point of sale. Would have to be very retrospective to catch people who already have those coins in their possession. Do you see that change happening realistically ?

Agreed, I'm only poking a bit of fun. They just said "QE3" on Bloomberg....

Just 3 announced so far? I'm sure they must have dates set all the way out to QE7, even if they're not broadcasting them yet.

After all, the first two worked so well, it would be positively negligent not to push more of them out to create more 'wealth' for everyone

I won't call the bottom until the SPX has corrected. However, I have been buying gold recently as you never know the future with certainty. There is a possibility the spx could grind sideways to burn off excessive complacency, but I think it is far more likely it will correct and bring gold down with it. As Gold is at its 200 dma, then I would only expect a max 5% drop in gold. Silver could easily correct another 10-20% from these levels.

 

The bottom isn't necessrily in yet!

I agree. My wealth in ounces in unchanged since Jan 2009. The nominal value in turdling could well drop further from here but I would not be as well protected as I have been had I not chosen to start protecting my wealth in real money when I did, and if I had responded in a knee jerk fashion to every negative fluctuation in turdling terms.

Think we need to measure wealth in ounces, not 'k'.

On which measure (that i fully understand) I'm as wealthy as I was since I stopped buying some time back. Is only human though to look at 'numbers' from time to time though

So, GBP 817 was possibly the bottom.

Looks like it might have been. Quite a jump up today. Did not cash out at the peak and was almost lamenting the money I never collected even though I consider myself to be a long term physical holder. Having 'lost' 30K in the last month it is reassuring that I was likely right in not losing my nerve...

Gold is off on a mini-tear by the looks of things. Very nearly $1,400/t.oz and it's teetering at the all time high in GBP as well, £903.90/t.oz.

 

2011 is going to be a good year to own gold/silver IMO.

Yep another GBP all time high 910.68

I'm sensing growing nervousness about a pull back on this thread. Time to bail?

Pullbacks come every year. Those of us with physical in our possession are used to it, accompanied as they generally are with stupidly sized annual increases.

GFs "wish" pullback would be bigger than any seen over the last 3 years so I'm not expecting it to happen. No disrespect GF (far from it) but you have to admit your $950 call is more of a wish (for enabling loading up) than anything else.

Nice floor at $1400 in gold and $28.5 in silver for now. Let's see what the JPMorgue can achieve tomorrow. My Gold SIPP isn't through yet, so $950 gold would be getting a warm welcome over here.

To be honest GF, $950 would leave me a little deflated temporarily.

cgnao - congrats that was a great call. Can you share how you arrived at this estimate back in sep 09?

And do you have any thoughts as to how far the present pullback will go ?

My net value of Au has almost trebled over last three years bought near £300 now £900.

 

Ag has more than doubled from £9 to £19.

 

Thanks CG et al.

I'd have gone further in earlier on but thought it was a bit of a wild punt based on some bloke on the interrnet. Glad I dipped my toe in when I did though otherwise I'd never have properly "protected myself"

The sad thing is though that I still can't afford to buy a decent house in W London suburbs

Edit: Without a mortgage that is - not too far off now though thanks to CG, Goldfinger et al

Getting there. Bull market is still young. But beware the correction.

Great to see you CG

Especially since today was the day the net value of my gold bought over the last 3 years hit the x2 (over purchase price) mark.

This just appeared on zerohedge; the same day as a particularly aurophobic thread (which isn't link worthy imho) on hpc

 

 

Aurophobia is defined by Webster's dictionary as an abnormal fear of everything gold; but it might be more aptly defined as 'the pathological and almost hysterical fear of owning gold, as espoused by the mainstream media'. The mainstream financial media seem to be falling prey to this malaise at an alarming rate. With gold rising seemingly in perpetuity not only in dollar terms but in a plethora of free-floating paper currencies, the antagonists are out in full force, their fear and loathing of gold for all to see. Gold seems to engender all manner of emotions, and there appears to be no middle ground. The mere mention of the word can induce comments more on a par with those of Marmite. People either 'love it or hate it', as the advert for the nation's most divisive breakfast spread chimes. Indeed the skew of hate from most media gets more pronounced at every new high. Indeed, every interim peak in gold's price over the last few years has been accompanied by a cacophony of voices proclaiming it to be overvalued. The inevitable retreats that have followed have been short-lived, briefly silencing the critics. However much to these critics’ consternation gold keeps making new highs, and with it their strident chorus of disbelief echoes out even more fervently. - Hinde Capital

Aurophilia has worked pretty well for me over the last 3 years

Doubt I am the one to ask, being a latecomer to 'beyond savings in Sterling'.

FWIW Don't the fundamentals point to gold going easily 5 times higher & possibly twice that?

I don't know your circumstances, but if the above occurs & you have kept your gold then you could consider escape (& early retirement) to a far better land.

 

It feels odd to offer my view as it's usually innocent me asking. It's only two years ago that I was reading GF & Cgnao & feeling like a rabbit caught in the headlights.

I understand. I switched into gold for the same reasons. In actual fact my gold fund came about from selling my last place (a flat in a not great area) and I always hoped at some point I might be able to buy somewhere nice for cash and I think that point may have arrived. Having lived here for nearly 3 years I know it's a nice house in a nice area so quite happy to consider dropping some roots. I know that house prices could well (almost certainly will) fall further but if we enter into a classic depression then so could gold prices. Likewise the 'hyperinflationary holocaust' may still happen but that could push house prices up at a similar pace so what would I gain ? As far as escaping to another country goes I'm not anywhere near retirement age and don't really have enough money to properly retire. I'd also be bored shitless within months - I'm one of those rare individuals that actually really enjoy their work.

Anyway, my landlord seems interested by my suggestion that we might buy this place - he moved from here down to the West Country and now has 3 kids so he won't be moving back. I guess it just comes down to whether we can agree on a price. I await his call with interest....

There's still only a few of us.

 

RB's sig:-

 

& the great (he thinks he is) Hamish McTavish, ex-HPC irritant & now on MSE; yesterday in reply to a Q from me :-

 

I had an evening phone call from a bank yesterday, the one very obliging Portuguese bank (almost an oxymoron here re the others). They had sold my OH's Euro investment in just one day as customers were "still queuing up for it as the rate was so good". I was watching Au v € at the time, enrieb's rocket had turned upwards again. I remarked that I hoped the money would still be worth something when it arrived in our account next Monday. The bank guy did not understand! I said "Take a look at a live Gold chart, the Euro is collapsing". I had ventured into territory beyond his ken.

Hi Laura. Question for you. If I were to buy (in a CASH sale) my house from my landlord with the money I've made from my gold would that be a mistake in your view?

Gold for me has always been about protecting my interests. I view having 100% ownership of shelter as a big part of that. Does that make sense ?

COT are caught with their pants down on the wrong side of the market and if they do not manage to rein it back quick, they'll be forced to cover which will send it parabolic.

 

cg, I think you're right. If China wants to relocate gold from London to Hong Kong, there will be a little problem in London IMO. Or does anyone think the banksters really just stored that gold there? IMO, this gold has possibly been shorted, physically sold etc. I.e. someone will possibly have to buy shed loads in the over the counter market. That's going to be expensive.

+1

I was talking to someone at work today about the current rocket shot in the POG and exactly the same thought occurred to me. I told him at the time that my thinking was a bit tinfoil, but if it was the case that much of the the gold likely to be recalled to HK isn't held by the current "custodians", then there are going to be an awful lot of big buyers in the marketplace right now paying whatever it takes in a desperate attempt to avoid getting busted.

Edit @ bjm81. Congrats on your new arrival

No we haven't. Nearly every investment bank apart from Morgan and Goldman has collapsed. You can't compare any banking crisis in living memory with what we have going on now.

 

The Bretton Woods agreement is collapsing.

Bretton Woods died in 1971, when the US "suspended" gold/USD convertibility. Funny how they never reinstated it.

Ouch.

 

Gold getting poleaxed in pounds today. Yikes. Down 20 quid or so.

 

Just been to Bullionvault. Now I'm a BV fan, but I think interviews like this one: http://goldnews.bullionvault.com/gold_us_default_122920081 with Bob Moriarty do them no favours.

 

Bob suggests the USA is about to break down into warring feudal statelets in one sentence and then suggests people invest in gold mining stocks in the next sentence. If the USA has fallen apart and the government failed, who on earth is going to be in a position to defend property rights relating to stocks traded on an electronic exchange?!

 

Bob is fairly apocalyptic in this article and, I think, does himself no favours. He is pretty specific about timelines and is going to look pretty stupid if it doesn't pan out like he says (and I can't believe it will - the US will inflate rather than default on bonds, surely? - that is the prerogative of the reserve currency nation...)

Boioioioiiing!!

Was expecting a major smackdown today (end of year profit-taking) but from the action in the last few minutes it looks like the market might have other ideas.

Not counting chickens though - there's still time for a good kicking

Down hugely in USD, up in GBP!

That's some almighty fall in sterling.

I'm 1/3 cash, 2/3 physical gold - mostly sovs with a small number of britneys and krugs.

Wot no smackdown ?

[words that will not doubt come back to haunt me in a matter of minutes or seconds]

it is politely called 'bad tick' , but in reality it is a manipulation at NY exchange and it is used to take bullish positions off on stop or margin calls. usually happens before a bullish wave. later this bad ticks are removed like nothing happened.

Ooh! Sneaky!

Yay!

Back above 750

For now at least...

Hi.

 

Can "they" really manipulate things this easily? If they can, why don't they just do it all the time so the stock market, commodities, the dollar etc fit in with what they want? This will surely cost them a fortune or do you think they can cause market panics and let the poor investor take the hit for minimal outlay?

 

Regards,

Roy.

I guess we'll find out in about 2-3 months.

This may lead to further dollar strength with panicked investors and hedge funds flying even faster to "quality" . Absurd isn't it!

 

The decline of the dollar may be left waiting in the wings for a few more months. Then the fun will really begin.

 

For those with dry powder, it could be an excellent buying op.

What's the betting it's held off until sometime shortly after 4th November? It must be taking every possible scam and spin to keep things going until after the elections. Must be exhausting, which suggests to me it will fall all apart soon after the votes are counted, if they can keep it going until then.

Edit: Typos