pmaupoil

Sorry just bought some more at lunch at 11.3. It always goes down afterwards...

I only have some "remote" physical gold and silver with BV and GM and I am now seriously thinking of "diversifying" my bullion investments by buying some coins. I have actually been thinking about it for quite a while now but still did not make the step.

One important question is the delivery process? How do you get delivered? Do you do it at work? If at home, aren't you afraid of the delivery man coming back at your place while you are on holiday with his van and a couple of friends to take your half-a-ton safe?

I am really sceptical about the security of holding bullion at home. Any thought on the matter? I may be too paranoid, I don't know.

I'm seriously tempted to sell my BV position while about even, as I'm worried about the talk of $650 where I'd be at a loss. Maybe some physical too. I thought this time of year was positive for gold so I might wait a while and see.

I do not know what is your investment strategy on gold but as a long-term investment, I would not take the risk to sell and buy during dips in such an uncontrolled climate. There are too many obscure forces! . The wisest strategy IMO is to keep and hold and stick with your original principles. These small falls are just noise to scare little investors and benefit large institutions to load up.

Sometimes I watch again Krassimir Petrov conferences to remind me that gold can only go one way in the next few years.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2...92869&hl=en

I need to diversify on silver, I meant to do it for months.

Quick question for Goldmoney users. I am going through the CAP documentation and I need certification of my passport photocopy from an authorised body. What type of free officer did you use, do you know whether a bank clerk is enough?

Cheers.

Makes sense - but doesn't answer all my questions.

 

The question is "Is this business model resilient in the event of a major gold price fall?" (in the way that so many practises in the housing market clearly weren't).

 

So there's one answer in that document:

 

"We may lower these daily limits at any time during periods of unusual market activity or high order volumes."

 

So they limit the amount you can sell, and can even suspend your right to sell. Presumably any more than a temporary suspension would kill their business as they need people's trust that they can sell as well as buy.

 

So if prices fell and kept falling they'd be put in the position of having to sell gold in a falling market to raise cash. Their sales (and those of other similar companies) would create a feedback loop pushing the price down further. They are also at this stage having their cash reserves depleted. If in a prolonged fall they start to have problems selling the gold, they either have to impose further suspensions and risk a serious 'run on the bank' or they have to try to pay out cash they don't have.

 

That seems to me at least a possibility, albeit one that would only come about in a serious price fall (like say 65%, as happened within living memory...)

 

Also, suppose they went out of business either for this reason or for extraneous reasons. No problem, you own the gold, right? But now you have to go get the gold. Plus they have other creditors whose only hope of getting any money lies in claiming against their assets, and the only assets they have are your gold. Does their legal assurance it's your gold hold up in court. Could creditors get the return of gold suspended, so it turns into a bankruptcy where you only get a share of the gold after a delay, while the gold price keeps falling?

 

I'm just thinking aloud but I think it's worth pondering whether business models developed in a benign period are robust in a downturn - I guess the housing market proves that.

This is quite an extreme case you are trying to describe, not just a significant fall but a collapse where there are very few buyers and in that case if you own your gold at home and try to sell it to your dealer nobody will want it for a decent price so I do not see the advantage of having gold at home in that particular context.

For the ones that use Coininvestdirect, are you satisfied with the quality of the coins? I do not want to be sent scratchy coins.

If you're interested in (to be fair, a somewhat tin-foil hat wearing) precis of the hows and whys of the depression of the 1930s and the bankers' part in it, check out the Zeitgeist movie. For the bit about the depression, begin at about 1 hour 17 mins into the documentary.

I watched most of the second half, I was quite depressed with that dreadful easter weekend but having watched it I feel even worse. Having said that, it really put the world into perspective and how we are conditioned. One major question that came up to my mind is if every large event is part of an agenda then how on earth the potential collapse of the current financial system can be one of them? I am pretty sure than Bernanke who is a "depressions" specialist must know exactly the consequences of his actions with his greedy buddies, right? What benefits could they get from it? Are we perhaps going to get a black swan along the corner?

All Investments

Sort of - Tried to with Hiscox, but they would not/could not insure for anything reasonable at the end. M&S Home Insurance is unlimited though so have gone with them. Have not declared PMs as high value items to them as individually none of my coins or coin sets are £4k or more and they are not a collection (as per M&S terms) Just ensure you have proved ownership. Also it could be prudent to spread the stash using safety deposit boxes which come with their own insurance.

...

I don't know the full details about CGT, but I do know that sovereigns and Britannias are exempt from CGT because they are classed as currency coins: legal tender. I think it depends on how much you sell and profit from in one year but others can explain it better and these links give more info. I personally will get round the issue by using friends and family to sell gold for me when it gets to a high enough level so that I do not go over my CGT limit. Also I am not sure that I trust the government will uphold CGT exemption on sovereigns and Britannias should gold become even more valuable, so I only own a small amount of Britannias and sovereigns atm.

 

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/cg4manual/CG78308.htm

 

http://reviews.ebay.com/CGT-Capital-Gains-...000000001593758

...

Thanks a lot for your answers guys! Really appreciated your input and links.

OK I am now ready to buy my first coins. I do not really know whether it will be gold and/or silver and which ones. For that, I still have a few questions and I was hoping you may be able to help on that.

I have been through the whole thread already finding out about it a bit more and got quite a few tips already especially from ConvertedGoldBug who was asking many relevant questions.

1-Someone mentioned an allowance for CGT of £9300, is that an allowance for gold and/or silver or all my investments?

2-On the delivery side, I am not confident in getting my coins deliveries at home to be honest. Can you get the first delivery at work for instance. What do you usually do?

3-Did you add your physical PM as part of your contents insurance? Is it expensive? Is it worth it?

4-I always hear about the same coins: sovereigns, britannias, maples, eagles and krugs. Why are you only mentioning these ones? What makes them so valuable to you? What about the Napoleon or Wilhelm ones for example? How do you make your choice? Do you tend to buy more of the ones from the country you live in?

5-I noticed that the silver eagle 1oz 2007 is slightly cheaper than the 2008 one. Does that mean my coins may lose value every year after a new version is printed?

6-I read that the krugs are the most common ones therefore easier to sell and cheaper. Well, I just had a look on COININVESTDIRECT and the krugs are at $976 against $967 for the maples and eagles so not quite true then...?

7-What makes you buy coins rather than bullion (some 1oz are available)? What if some specific coins get depreciated? Do you think coins tend to gain more value over time or is it simply for the joy of owning a specific coin like you own a nice stamp?

I think that's it. I cannot think of anything else for now

Many thanks in advance.

Happy days are here again

 

The dow crashes yesterday on the bad news,

today it goes up on Lehman getting rescued from their other buddie banks/fed

All the CBs are doing is to give the markets short-term boosts and then back to reality... This game may still last for a few weeks/months but these liquidity injections and interest rate cuts will not solve the fact that probably most of the banks are insolvent...

They changed the direction of the graph tonight on Kitco, it is all vertical!!!

You'll like this one goldfinger, one of his predictions was for gold at $30,000 an ounce.

Yes but with hyperinflation predictions, if I can only still buy one nice suit with $30000 an ounce then I will be able to say that I have not lost any money which is not bad I suppose

Welcome Kingfisher, curious to know how you found us, I thought the Mods had blocked all reference to this site?

GF nicely sent us messages on HPC

Gold holding up very well above 1000. I really did not expect that today TBH. I expected at most a kiss to 1000 and then a massive sale.

I was wondering why I could view any chart during a few minutes. Well above 1000 now!

Most of the people I meet know about the commodities boom and certainly the gold one which gets some fair publicity but when they look at the graphs and the fact that gold quadrupled in the past 7/8 years, they just think they missed the boat...

At the moment Joe Public is not too concerned with inflation of around 5% but when the effect of the massive injections will start causing significant increased prices and most importantly the frequency of these increases then Joe will have no choice but to opt for some PM and then mania will start.

This is not a mania.

I think it's easy to get the impression everyone is buying gold by looking at threads like this.

This is so wrong.

 

Outside the forums on gold I only know one person who has bought gold.

Most people I talk to about gold think I'm nuts, stupid, and am going to lose when the bubble bursts - tomorrow

 

A mania is when everyone you talk to asks you how to buy gold, or even worse tells you you should be buying, and boast about how much they have bought.

 

Combine that with the view that this is probably a once in a century combination of events.

This is not a speculative bubble. This is a move to a safe haven which has been undervalued for a long time.

 

Just my views

Steve

The $1000 gold price is everywhere in the news although I could not see it from my own eyes in any spot price chart.

There could be another attempt this morning, gold is doing pretty well over 998 but I still think it will struggle again for a few days to go beyond that 1000 barrier.

999.46, come on you can do it boy!

998.75 now on livecharts!

Where is the official price? Comex?

 

Dow breaking down again. Mr Market wants a rate cut and he ain't going to stop crying until he gets one.

Bernanke is currently going through all his pockets. What is he going to come up with this time?

Now I see why. Gold has hit $1000 spot

 

It did not. Use that one instead

http://www.livecharts.co.uk/MarketCharts/gold.php

Back up to 997!

NY opening is going to be interesting...

I still think it won't surpass the 1000 mark in the next few days.

I would like to be wrong though

Thanks for the links

I have two favourites.

 

You'll want to pick the country domain that suites your needs.

http://www.hifx.co.nz/marketwatch/currency...rical_data.aspx

or

http://www.hifx.co.uk/marketwatch/currency...rical_data.aspx

 

But I now prefer this one, as it does a lot more, and has gold/silver on it.

 

http://netdania.com/ChartApplet.asp

Does anyone know a good link for real time or 15/20min delay currency rates? The Yahoo one is quite bad.

On the other hand, I quite like that one for comparing all major currencies to gold: http://goldprice.org/gold-price.html

Lately, I've been watching the gold price in UK£ more than in US$, and, having just flicked back to US$ on the BV chart, I'm amazed at how different the graphs look between the two currencies.

 

It seems the gold price in UK£ and US$ mostly follow each other more or less, but comparing the activity this week, in UK£, the price (although as volatile as usual) isn't really going anywhere, but, in US$, there's a very definite climb!

 

Just a further weakening of the US$?

Exactly! It is currently quite frustrated. Gold is truly underperforming at the moment, once it breaks the psychological $1000 barrier which I believe may still take a few days or weeks, it will go ballistic like oil did on the $100!