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id5

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  1. Hi all, I have recently cleared out the garden shed and quite fancy the idea of setting up a mini silver refining "shed project". :rolleyes:

     

    http://www.goarticles.com/cgi-bin/showa.cgi?C=732873

     

    I have loads of scrap silver and thought it may be interesting to have a go at making my own bars. The wife thinks I'm mad, but has anyone else tried refining silver.

     

    Graphite molds in a variety of sizes are cheap enough to buy and although the process of refining appears quite complicated, I could have multiple stages of the process on the go at the same time.

     

    Thought it could be a interesting hobby-type project, obviously, with due dilligence to health and safety aspects.

     

    Am I mad? :lol:

    I still refine small quantities of gold and silver although now only to produce metal that can be used in jewellery, most of this is just melt, assay, remedy and use. I still use some chemicals such as nitric but UK Health & Safety being what it is gets in the way of getting large enough quantities of nitric unless you have a fume hood, etc. We buy one later next year as may have a need for both a hood and the nitric.

     

    Unless you know what you are doing with acids and the reactions from other materials then do yourself a favour and keep away. If you breathe in the fumes you can get your lungs burnt and they do not recover. There are some real killer chemical reactions as well, especially the cyanide ones.

     

    It can be fun but it will never be as cheap as the big boys with their cyanide leech and electro-winning equipment.

     

  2. I am persuaded that good trading consists in doing absolutely nothing 99.9% of the time. :rolleyes:

    I would go with that but change it slightly to

     

    I am persuaded that good trading consists in forcing yourself to do absolutely nothing 99.9% of the time.

     

    It is so hard to be dispassionate..m investment failures have been because I panicked, just couldn't resist and added a bit more or coming out of a trade too early. Plan your trade and trade your plan.

  3. Is that a euphemism? :unsure:

    I know I spotted that one earlier.... :unsure:

    It can be if you want it to, wordplay is one of the beauties of the English language. FYI on average gold does little between the end of Nov and the beginning of Jan but then it takes off again, hence the need for freshly polished rocket pictures :)

  4. ...I tell you what, I have never had the feeling I have looking at or holding silver/gold with £20 notes I can tell you. You feel like you actually have something don't you, that can't be altered overnight.

    Thats why I kept on going on at Magpie when he was around about real money, something that the average man on the street can understand, something that would still hold some value after the currency that it was used to represent had collapsed.

  5. yes, I don't like the look of these either compared to the first batch.

     

    I do however like (or think I like based on pictures) the very old tarnished look also, it's just these bars seem to be in the middle, not properly tarnished, not shiny new looking.......no mans land so to speak.

     

    It's all very interesting though. I should have been doing this years ago. I have always had a very strong interest in Jewellery for some reason.

    GOM, these are older bars. Note the 999 which is reference to the purity of 99.9%, the unmarked bar will be even older at 99.5%. New bars from Heraeus are refined to 99.99%.

     

    I will be happy to take these and any other off your hands off your hands at spot minus a handling fee of course :)

  6. Some may be doing better than others. My folks run a post office and see a steady stream of parcels being shipped of to postalgold and cash4gold etc... any jewellers/pawn shop owners here noticed an increase in gold trade?

    But they are often with only a small amount of gold in them that barely covers the cost of the shipping which is now paid for by the gold reclaimer using Special Delivery licensed post. It is still more effective for them to collect from the local jewellers.

     

    I have just come back fom the IJL where I had a few interesting chats to a few of the jewellery manufacturers and to the precious metal producers like Johnson Mathey. They are worried as the increase in gold price is hurting them through lack of sales. There was also less gold jewellery on display except for the standard diamond encrusted white gold. The vast majority of jewellery this year was silver. Everyone was saying that compared to gold silver seems cheap.

  7. ...There is some mention that the government are behind these companies....

    No, just a few guys in the metals and jewellery markets. I was talking to someone that owns one of these companies and it is not getting the response that it hoped for as many people prefer to use a local jeweller or pawn shop.

  8. None of my coins weigh exactly right. My scales are 0.01g, I think that they are not that accurate, but then 0.01 grams is very little and I doubt the coins are that accurate either. You might own a kilo bar of gold that weighs 1008 grams for example, but you will only be able to sell it based on its value as a kilo. The same goes with coins.

    The law is very particular on coin weight and size, and these laws are enforced through the Trial of the Pyx that is the longest running trial in the world. The weight of a silver Britannia is 32.45 grams and it is not permitted to be less when issued, there is no downside tolerance to either weight or composition on UK coinage. The little pocket digital scales that I use for coins can read to 0.01g but have a tolerance of 0.1g. So if I weigh a new silver Britannia it will be above 32.35grams on my scales when they are calibrated correctly. The only other fixed dimension is the diameter of 40mm and this has a tolerance of 2%, so a silver Britannia will be up to 40.8mm before the die is removed from use, although they are generally taken out before this. Do not forget that your ruler, micrometer, etc will also have a tolerance that is also affected by temperature.

     

    But honestly you do not need to be this anal about your coins. If you think that they are fake take them to a coin dealer and ask. The coin dealer will have seen so many that they will be able to tell the fake by sight, touch and by feeling its weight. The human senses are amazing and after seeing a 100 or so of the same coin from different vendors you would be able to spot a fake very quickly.

     

    ...The square plastic cover is stamped with 'The Royal Mint'. This material should be suitable if the Royal Mint are using it. Right? :unsure: ...

    Unless they are airtight then they are not suitable. If you are storing them singly then use capsules, in multiples then a tube but store them in the dark as this helps to reduce chemical reactions.

     

  9. ...can I ask is it worth ring testing the silver bars ? ...

    No, coins ring because they have been made in a press. Although some bar is now pressed rather than cast the ring test does always produce the same result.

     

    yes I think I need some good scales etc. I have bought the fisch wallets, ...

    Fisch balances are based on older technology that used to be prevalent in banks to check coin before the microchip was invented but you need different balances for different coin weights and sizes. All you need today is a cheap set of digital scales and a ruler. The coin will never exceed the maximum diameter or weight for the coin, forget a coins height as it changes on the amount of pressure applied by the press.

     

    sounds like a good idea as it would be just too impractical to test each one....

    Just make sure that you know zero and adjust your scales, then measure and weigh one coin out of the packet to prove what it is and then weight it in the packet, weigh the remaining coins in the packets. You will soon spot if one of the packets is slightly over or under and that it will make little difference to the weight because it is so light.

     

    ....The coins go back in to the plastic but they don't seal properly. At least one layer of plastic fell off and couldn't be put back on. I think there was 3 or 4 layers total....

    Do not store silver coins in plastic unless it is Mylar or similar. Most PVC's release Hydrochloric acid over time, faster in sunlight and it will turn your coins black over time. Silver Britannia's are not really bullion coins because they are produced in such low numbers.

     

    ... Do some coins need more care than others? I'm sure it doesnt matter.

    I am sure that it does, that is why there are coin collectors and why they pay stupid prices for well kept coins.

     

  10. ... Pandas are the nicest coins I have. How do they do the diagonal milled edge I wonder?...

    They are milled into the die that the coin blank is pressed into. After stamping into the die the bottom of the die lifts and rotates to force the coin out. There have been a number of coins that have had diagonal reeding on the edge, originally it was an attempt to make both counterfeiting and coin clipping harder.

  11. I still find it hard to believe that the UK has such a Mickey Mouse system for selling homes.

    ...

    This is in HK$ per square foot, so you can multiply the square footage of your property by this number, and make some adjustments for the floor, view, etc., and you have a very good idea what your property is worth. Also, there are websites where you can input the location of your property, and get a precise valuation.

    ...

    History Dr. B. history. It's been a 1,000 years since the UK has been conquered, the Civil War was just a power struggle not a revolution and its result just a change of heads. There are just too many vested interests from the legal and banking fraternities to want or allow a change, you can also add in the estate agents, surveyors, financial advisors, etc that all make a cut of any attempted sale. Labour tried to make a change but ended up making the system even more of a rip off with their Home Information Pack.

     

    As to selling houses by the sq ft or sq metre, if that was to happen in the UK all and sundry would be able to see that the recent rise in house prices was not due to the market getting better but because of those that have brought a larger house at a discounted price, although one above the average. ‘It’s a bargain! And look, we got it right because now house prices are increasing!’. Sadly the fundamentals that caused the original drop in price are still there, just peeking out from behind the curtain, their effects just delayed by the government trying to make things look better, stringing out the game just a little bit further.

     

  12. I thought the POS would fall too…. Those thoughts flew straight out of the window when the BofE extended its QE programme.

     

    Mother ******* are determined to monetise every last bit of debt. They are not even bothering to pretend otherwise.

     

    Nothing wall fall in price while this crazy money printing continues. Nothing!

     

    By the end of this year (when I am more certain about my job) I will be buying hard assets with every last bit of Sterling from my bank accounts and taking out some extra Sterling debt – Probably in the form of a life-of-balance interest rate on a credit card and silver coins from Airdale Coins.

    As Yoda would say 'Hard to see the dark side is'

     

    I am already getting out of Sterling and into anything that might hold water such as other currencies and PM's, if your base currency is GBP then I believe that you should get ready for a poor financial harvest this autumn. Sterling may have held up since the beginning of the financial year but all of the charts I look at suggest that the only direction is south.

     

    Personally, I think that we are in for a repeat of last year from here to spring. A few more big companies, banks, etc will go under because they are not big enough for the governments to let fail, the markets will have a tough time. I suspect though that some of the players will be different, governments, currencies, banks and businesses that were strong may become weak. I will keep all of my investments fluid and hop from one to another as they all sink again.

     

  13. However, he cautioned that when interest rates ultimately start to rise again as the wider economy recovers, the strong house price increases of recent months "would become difficult to sustain".

     

    "The eventual exit from exceptionally loose monetary policy could make the recovery in the housing market bumpier than some might expect after the last few months of price increases," said Mr Gahbauer.

     

    I wonder how many readers have missed these words of wisdom.

  14. That 10-level (Dow/Gold) looks rather important.

    It looks like we have rallied up to "kiss it goodbye"

     

    I expect to Gold to fall with stocks for a few days, before it "finds its feet" and rallies

    If money flows out of stocks Dr. B. where do you expect it to go? The answer to that may be worth a long trade.

  15. I recall a post on HPC ages ago where some chap was arguing that investing in gold was a mugs game as eventually scientists will be able to make gold out of other elements. Wish I could find the post now it was hilarious. I remember the chap getting quite indignant saying "and yes the technology does exist" then going on to say gold atoms are produced as a by-product of reactions in large hadron colliders! Not exactly a very cost efficient approach :lol:

    I remember that thread! He also started going on about a thin layer of gold being formed on the lead sheilding inside nuclear reactors, another money spinner i'm sure :lol:

  16. I agree - but feel only 50% confident in this call.

     

    Therefore, I today bought another kg (now own 3), whilst having cash in reserve to buy another 4-5 if the big drop does occur. [if it doesn't happen, and I miss the rocket, I'll just pay of a mortgage with the cash].

     

    Now back to work...

    Congrats... but was a little more information than was needed. ;)

    Unless of course you are keeping it at home, in which case would you please tell me your address, PM me for secrecy :lol:

  17. That chart of repossessions is something else. I am delighted I don't have a mortgage, but feel for my friends who do. One friend has a mortgage of £287,000 on a property that's on the market for £299,000.

     

    If it sells for the asking price, she will just about have the funds to pay off the mortgage plus the various fees triggered by the sale. If she gets an offer for less, she would be subsidising the buyer by taking a loss on the place.

     

    I really hope she gets any offer and takes it. I expect interest rates will rise next year, and even people like her on a good salary will have trouble meeting their increased mortgage costs.

     

    I think more people are in this position than I realised. Pretty much anyone who bought in the last few years in treading water at best.

    But there are some that you just can't feel sorry for. I have a friend who owns his own house outright, has a small portfolio of mortgaged rentals which he lets predominately to people he employs and is just about to exchange on a new house with a mortgage. He believes that the market will only go up from here and cannot see that if his company’s revenue takes a hit so will his portfolio, etc. :(

  18. If you want to make something I'd buy from you, here's an idea... I would like a purpose made PVC tube (ideally translucent) to accept the largest gold coin in a coin capsule. You would only need to make one diameter, as to pad out the inside of the coin capsule for smaller coins with a foam ring would be fine.

     

    These would ideally be 12" long with a thread at both ends of the tube to either extend the tube by screwing in another section or an end cap. I would of course expect the tubes to be water/air tight.

     

    Just a thought, no one seems to make them.

    Better still, make the tube out of Mylar including the foam rather than PVC and then Silver can be safely stored in them as well.

  19. The ISO are not policing the boarders, what counts is the HMRC's edict, as I have provided.

     

    As regards to the Japs and their US bonds, a US bond is a dollar dominated IOU note with a face value that is honourable by the US government. An unminted, faceless piece of gold or silver is a commodity and no one has to honour it as payment.

     

    So if you take your gold out of the EU and lets say it's a 1kg bar of gold, with no face value, so would the customs chose to value it at spot price or buy price, sell price for an ingot?

     

    Now, he comes an interesting scenario you have to declare and/or get stopped and questioned about your 1kg bar of gold, and for argument's sake let's say they value it at spot price, so this would mean you would be above the 10,000 euro threshold. However, I am traveling through at the same time with 80 X one troy ounce gold britannias, which would be approximately 2.5kg of gold, however brittanias are legal tender, honourable to the value of £100 each, so my 80 brits come under the limit at £8,000. I could do even better with sovereigns as I could travel with 8000 X £1 sovereigns having a net weight of 58kgs in gold!

    The face value of a coin is the minimum that the coin is worth as legal tender, in the UK that means that a court would accept in payment for a fine or other debt payable to the court.

     

    HMRC take the market value of the coin not its face value, so about £620 at todays prices.

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