nicejim

I see an animal with some obvious characteristics of a duck. I expect it to display other ducklike qualities. Is this, as a consequence of internally categorising it as a duck, or have I categorised it as a duck because I expect it to display these additional ducklike qualities. Both. However, the idea that the assignment to generic type informs the expectation, is the point I was making, so I'm happy with my phrasing, thanks.

Are you saying that your view of gold changes the way you expect people to behave?

Indeed. Not sure why you think I meant anything else.

Because I'd have expressed that sentiment as

"expected behaviour, has important consequences in terms of defining gold as a) money or a commodity or c) something else entirely."

defining gold as a) money or b) a commodity or c) something else entirely, has important consequences in terms of expected behaviour.

I think it's the other way round. You can't define gold as money and expect people to change their behaviour. You can only define it as money if you expect people to behave as if it is money.

Just $7 more to go on BV...

 

sorry, $6.

$0 in the London vault just now.

"Gold, unlike many other commodities is not consumed, and therefore the traditional models and theories of supply and demand simply do not apply!"

Ditto houses!

"The supply of scrap gold...has remained surprisingly slow"

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/16f72c6c-c73d-11...144feab49a.html

I do not know where I should post this

 

link

 

 

 

 

 

Does printing press cause environmental damage?

Compare and contrast with Bob Moriarty, who thinks Spanish nimbyists should not be allowed to prevent Bob Moriarty making a fortune whilst providing a few jobs for the locals. He'll be on a golf course far from the destruction by the time the acid mine drainage starts.

http://www.321gold.com/editorials/moriarty...arty092210.html

:lol:

 

I like that sig!

Except he's not turning paper into gold. He's converting one method of payment deferral (debt) into another (gold).

True, but I and a few others find this part of the Au Ag comparison troubling. Silver spent less than 1 year over $20 and only 3 months over $25. The silver market in 1980 was peculiar. What would silver have done without the Hunts? It's difficult to know.

 

I'm troubled by comparisons with the gold spike as well as the silver one. Unless gold is spiking at the moment, which I think is unlikely, you could ignore the 1980 spike, take the high to be about $550 and then compare silver with no spike.

Gold now: 1290

Gold then: 550

Silver now: 21

Silver then: 10-15 ish, maybe

So gold is a higher multiple of its old "high" than silver is.

MasterCard Worldwide is a leading global payments solutions company that provides a family of well-known, widely-accepted payment card brands including MasterCard®, Maestro® and Cirrus® and serves consumers, financial institutions, and businesses in over 210 countries and territories worldwide.

Credit is money!

How do you know it is not true? As I understand it, the BV trading bots offer less than another user would offer. I do not recall a representative of BV ever coming here to talk about their trading bots - only to reassure people that their gold would still be safe even after having taken on the Rothschilds as partners!

I know from experience.

"If you use it, you are trading directly with BV"

Not true. They do have bots trading for them, but not all trades are with the bots.

"they don't tell you this"

Not true. I was aware of this before using their system.

"they basically rape you"

Not true. I checked a few contracts to see whether the "P" was displayed prominently. It is. But also, there were orders which were matched partly by BV and partly by other BV users, and plenty of orders were matched below the price I bid. I can't say for sure whether I got the best possible price but if I paid less than I was willing to pay then I have no reason to complain. My usual technique was (I've not bought any in a while now) to put in a cheeky bid below all the listed offers, for a small amount of gold, and it was often immediately filled at or below that by BV.

The quote is in italics - it is not me saying this - I am quoting from the link.

I know, but it's not a good idea to write or repeat things which are not true, especially considering BV have had to come here in the past to put things straight.

PS. I'm sure this won't affect you, but the "wizard" on their website which is designed to help noobs trade on their exchange is nothing short of a scam. I believe users have a reasonable expectation that this programme will get them the best price available, but it absolutely does not. If you use it, you are trading directly with BV (they don't tell you this) and they basically rape you. I complained to them about it, and was ignored. Another reason not to use them.

I've sometimes got better than the best price available and when I've traded directly with BV there is a "p" on the contract to show this. I remember that they stated in their T&C that they sometimes take the other side of the trade. I've sometimes been charged less than I've offered but never more. I don't know how the word "rape" can be used to describe this.

Errr... we haven't had hyper-inflation.

 

Most have seen an ongoing economic crisis.... though the way in which it plays out could surprise many.

Hyperinflation is only a tiny part of the hyperinflationary scenario, so it's harsh to criticise on this detail. When the Pope arrives in the UK and they change the currency, THEN you'll get it.

Well, that's a suggestive post.

 

1. Infinity

 

2. Unknown, but something greater than zero.

+1 but...

For question 1 it depends on what you mean by a Dollar. For example, you might say you can't buy gold with French Francs but an old French banknote or coin still has retail value. Are those still Francs? I have a 26.73 gram coin which is 90% silver and the writing on it tells me it is a United States Dollar. I guess I'll always be able to swap it for gold, but is it a Dollar...or is it $16.04?.

So, "Which of these two questions is easier to answer?"

Err...neither

Fake sovereign pictures from Chards. Maybe they're easier to spot "in the flesh"...

http://www.goldsovereigns.co.uk/fakes.html

100 years of fiat money?

99 years 364 days just wouldn't be enough.

$1268.70 now on Kitco :-)

Gold getting competition from dollar and real estate. Buy a place for 100k, mortgage of 500 dollars per month rent it out for 600.

Picking up dimes in front of a steamroller with a large weight tied to his ankle...for 1000 months (plus interest, plus costs).

Tom: "absolutely"... "gold is not a safe haven its correlated with the market"

Small fluctuations around the mean...

http://home.earthlink.net/~intelligentbear/com-dow-au.htm

1.5% in 2 hours, G/S below 62...

...it's a bit quiet in here...

Jim Rickards here uses something akin to Jim Sinclair's "External debt equilibrium model" to arrive at a price of gold ($39,000) and demonstrate the exorbitant privilege it has enjoyed by being able to print the global currency.

http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/KWN..._New_Opium.html

If they spent more than half their savings (from 20,000 tonnes of gold down to 9,000) between 1950 and 1970 then what is the likelihood that they reduced their savings only to zero in the subsequent 40 years? Neither Rickards nor Sinclair assume that the US should end up owing gold, in fact Rickards leaves it with nearly 3 times what China has (though if you repeat the example with other debtor and creditor nations it may get down to zero). If leaving the people of the USA with zero gold would represent a large gift then perhaps it could be explained to them that this solution is a good one (it would kill loads of government debt) and would leave them having enjoyed the fruits of the world's labour for 40 years at a knock down rate and with no comeuppance.

On the other hand, maybe that's too hard a sell. But getting rid of the debt would likely benefit both the Chinese and the Americans in the long run and we know which country in the world is most focused on the long run. If it's true that "there is nothing in the world which China lacks" and they can shift enough of their workers away from US export-derived occupations (to cut down on the inevitable social strife) then they could raise the Beijing Put to $20,000 and make out like bandits.

I like that term, "Great Correction". It's the best I've seen so far to describe the "event" we're living through.

The Price of Gold is Arbitrary

http://neuralnetwriter.cylo42.com/node/3409

 

"Roubini's opinion is significant because people listen to him." On that, I agree.

You might prefer something like this then, but wouldn't it be confuse people if Roubini started talking about the gold price of the dollar? The fact that people listen to him both means and stems from his language being framed in terms they are familiar with.

http://www.nysun.com/editorials/the-gold-audit/87065/

It strikes us that it would not be a bad thing were an audit to keep our national mind focused on our gold holdings — particularly at a time when the value of the dollar has collapsed to less than a 1,200th of an ounce of gold.

and yet they also add vat - i thought 2nd hand silver doesn't have to pay vat?

I'm not sure about that, but I did find this

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/SilverVAT/

"We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to Abolish VAT on Silver Coins and Bullion to bring equality with the No-VAT position on Gold"

Deadline to sign up by: 03 June 2010 – Signatures: 27

Boy, has silver NOT gone mainstream!

Interesting...CID is now selling US junk silver

http://coininvestdirect.com/en/silver_coin...ngton_type.html

http://coininvestdirect.com/en/silver_coin...evelt_type.html