THOUGHTS On Local Property Portals: Makati & Beyond

[drbubb]

THOUGHTS On Local Property Portals -in Makati & Beyond

THOUGHTS On a Local Property Portal (to share & discuss with CEstates and others)

I believe…

We need online local property portals that provide direct access to pricing information for buyers and sellers. Not.just agents

Already, CEstates are working on a platform which may revolutionize the secondary market.  As someone who has bought and sold property in: USA, UK, HK, PHP, & Thailand, I find the system in PHP to be very primitive and in need of change.  Philippines property developers may be well served by the current system, but not buyers and sellers.  Those who want to sell their properties in the secondary market, are especially poorly served.  And prospective buyers of properties in the secondary market have very limited information on what prices have been achieved and what is on offer.  The result is ... a sluggish and frustrating secondary market with limited liquidity, and lack of transparency... slow, inefficient and often expensive transactions.

I know the Founder of Cestates and have had several meetings with him.  I want to encourage CEstates to start with a slimmed down version of their system, maybe without the Cryptos.  The slimmed down version might be offered on A TRIAL BASIS only within a few small local hub areas, in small neighborhoods within Makati & BGC.  Perhaps Alveo’s recently turned over Kroma Tower, where I am about to move, might be within one of the first Hub locations that could be launched.

In my formulation: only those who are direct buyer or sellers, or their representatives on each side using a maximum one agent would be able to access the Local hub.  Commissions might be in the region of 2-3% all-in.

Anyone who wants access as a buyer, seller or agent would have to qualify in some way.  For instance, Sellers might have to show a copy of a clean title. Buyers might show they have some cash. Agents would need to be licensed, and demonstrate they have some genuine knowledge of the local area, and the condos within the local hub.  This would help to assure that those who want to buy and talk to Hub participants, that there are getting access to people with sufficient local knowledge, and knowledge of a building's amenities and its special features,

The idea to use the qualification process, and the hyper local focus on only a few buildings, to eliminate some of the issues that would delay a transaction,  (this idea and the thinking is still in flux, so it may go in a different direction, or the qualification process may morph. But that is how I see it now.)

If two agents are involved, one for the Buyer and one for the seller: then they would each get a piece of the commission and something would go to the platform too.  If the buyer or seller enters portal directly, then the total commission might be less than 3%. The chain would be kept small, with maybe two agents maximum. Those who qualify would have access to some transparent (& verified) info on the buyer's unit or the seller's requirements.

Hyper-Local focus
Once again, each Local portal might only include a small number of buildings.  For example, the "City Gate Hub" might include just Kroma, Rise, Air, and One Central - and perhaps Two and Three Central as well.  Maybe people who can prove they own property in one of those building would have preferred access to their local portal, and maybe pre-qualify simply by owning property there.  Each portal might have a "champion" (or champions) who would collect and update specific details of the properties within the local area. Participants would also be expected to have some common agreement on pricing.

Many investors whom I know agree that PH property selling needs a major upgrade - and especially the secondary market. Aside from local portals, people want to see things like centralization of listings, enhanced laws, etc.  But as one person, or as part of a small group, it is maybe impossible to change the laws of a country.  We don't have to wait for that.  We can launch an a Local Hub portal within the existing law,  The aim would be to encourage some different behaviors on the part of buyers, sellers, and agents.  The present challenges and possible solutions need to be thought through and brainstormed to make the new system work.  It can be introduced first at a local level, without needing to educate the entire Great Manila area, or the whole country.  Later, what has proven to work, the portal and its practices can be discussed with the press. Then maybe the idea will spread to other local areas, creating more hubs in an organic way, driven by the demands of buyers and sellers who want improved efficiency and access to their own hub.

I have had some successes (including some Noteworthy & even "celebrated" successes I can describe) in creating new markets, and bringing in new market practices in business areas like oil trading and within the global shipping market.  I have some idea of the challenges, and the way to tackle the issues that come up,  Of course every market is different, and PH has some unique challenges.  But my historical experience leaves me with confidence that change can happen, and it can be initiated with a few small steps, if they are the right first steps.  Having said this, I will need help and cooperation from others, and I encourage people to step forward who may want to help on this project.  Initially, it will involve voluntary rather than paid efforts. Nevertheless, pioneers may find rich rewards, as they have in markets that I have helped develop in the past.  The first step will be more brainstorming on the requirements and challenges to make the portal idea work.  I envision a series of meetings where the idea(s) will be presented and discussed, as the concept slowly evolves into a working system.

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LINKS:

CEstates --- : https://www.cestates.io/

Ten X Commercial : https://www.ten-x.com/commercial/

Lauren Property -- : https://web.facebook.com/pg/Lauren-Property-Listings-for-Sale-970276926511231/reviews/?ref=page_internal

63 Realty /Fang -- : https://63fang.ph/property/香格里拉the-rise-makati单间出售/

[drbubb]

(Original version of the memo in pieces... Suitable for mobile phones?)

THOUGHTS On a Local Property Portal (to share & discuss with CEstates)

I believe… We need online local property portals that provide direct access to pricing information for buyers and sellers. Not.just agents

Already, CEstates are working on a platform which may revolutionize the secondary market.  As someone who has bought and sold property in: USA, UK, HK, PHP, & Thailand, I find the system in PHP to be very primitive and in need of change.  The developers are well served by the current system, but not buyers and sellers.  Those who want to sell their properties in the secondary market, are especially poorly served.  And prospective buyers of properties in the secondary market have very limited information on what prices have been achieved and what is on offer.  The result is ... a sluggish and frustratiing secondary market with limited liquidity, and lack of transparency... slow, inefficient and often expensive transactions.

I know the Founder of Cestates and have had several meetings with him.  I want encourage CEstates to start with a slimmed down version of their system, maybe without the Cryptos.  The slimmed down version might be offered on A TRIAL BASIS only within a few small local hub areas.  And perhaps Alveo’s recently turned over Kroma Tower, where I am about to move, might be within one of the first Hub locations that could be launched.

In my formulation: only those who are direct buyer or sellers, or their representatives on each side using a maximum one agent would be able to access the Local hub.  Commissions might be in the region of 2.5-3% all-in.

/ 2 /

Anyone who wants access as a buyer, seller or agent would have to qualify in some way.  For instance, sellers might have to show a copy of a clean title. Buyers to show they have some cash. Agents would need to be licensed, and demonstrate  they have some genuine knowledge of the local area, and the condos within the local hub.  This would help to assure that those who want to buy and talk to Hub participants, that there are getting access to people with sufficient local knowledge, and knowledge of a building's amenities and its special features. Participants would also be expected to have some common agreement on pricing.

The idea to use the qualification process, and the hyper local focus on only a few buildings, to eliminate some of the issues that would delay a transaction,  (this idea and the thinking is still in flux, so it may go in a different direction, or the qualification process may morph. But that is how I see it now.)

If two agents are involved, one for the Buyer and one for the seller: then they would each get a piece of the commission and something would go to the platform too.  If the buyer or seller enters portal directly, then the total commission might be less than 3%. The chain would be kept small, with maybe two agents maximum. Those who qualify would have access to some transparent (& verified) info on the buyer's unit or the seller's requirements.

/ 3 / Hyper-Local focus. Example: "City Gate Hub"
Once again, each Local portal might only include a small number of buildings.  For example, the "City Gate Hub" might include just Kroma, Rise, Air, and One Central - and perhaps Two and Three Central as well.  Maybe people who can prove they own property in one of those building would have preferred access to their local portal, and maybe pre-qualify.  Each portal might have a "champion" (or champions) who would collect and update specific details of the properties within the local area

Many may agree that PH property selling needs a major upgrade - and especially the secondary market. Aside from local portals, people want to see things like centralization of listings, enhanced laws, etc.  But as one person, or as part of a small group, it is maybe impossible to change the laws of a country.  We don't have to wait for that.  We can launch an a Local Hub portal within the existing law,  The aim would be to encourage some different behaviors on the part of buyers, sellers, and agents.  The present challenges and possible solutions need to be thought through and brainstormed to make the new system work.  It can be introduced first at a local level, without needing to educate the entire Great Manila area, or the whole country.  Later, what has proven to work, the portal and its practices can be discussed with the press. Then maybe the idea will spread to other local areas, creating more hubs in an organic way, driven by the demands of buyers and sellers who want improved efficiency and access to their own hub.

/ 4 /

I have had some successes (including some Noteworthy & even "celebrated" successes?) in creating new markets, and bringing in new market practices in business areas like oil trading and within the global shipping market.  I have some idea of the challenges, and the way to tackle the issues that come up,  Of course every market is different, and PH has some unique challenges.  But my historical experience leaves me with confidence that change can happen, and it can be initiated with a few small steps, if they are the right first steps.  Having said this, I will need help and cooperation from others, and I encourage people to step forward who may want to help on this project.  Initially, it will involve voluntary rather than paid efforts. Nevertheless, pioneers may find rich rewards, as they have in markets that I have helped develop in the past.  The first step will be more brainstorming on the requirements and challenges to make the portal idea work.  I envision a series of meetings where the idea(s) will be presented and discussed, as the concept slowly evolves into a working system.

[drbubb]

DISCUSSION:

Q: What are the top 3 specific challenges you would like to see the portal solving ?

A: Top 3 issues:

Transparency, Efficiency (shortening chains & reducing cost), Enhanced local knowledge
Foreigner friends have said: "Where is the secondary market?  I cannot find it"
Financing issues might be tackled later - once the effort has more credibility

Q: What is wrong with OLX and Lamudi? They have a good list of secondary market properties

A: I disagree.  They are not doing an adequate job.  Have you tried to use OLX? Or Lamudi?  They are loaded up with stale and "spoof" transactions.  And many brokers are there using false information to try to "harvest" unsuspecting buyers.

(Q posted this: "I think those 2 sites plus the others are now trying to seek the legal portion of the transaction ... what we might need then is a FSBO site ...")

Q: On Transparency: Many moons ago when the zonal valuation was still very low compared to actual market values, a lot of Tax Cheating was going on ... so there was never a transparent real closing sale value ... this has narrowed down now that zonal values have gone close to market values.

A: As for zonal valuations, I find this bizarre:  I spoke to an Avida sales person, who was trying to sell me on the virtues of Avida Sxxxx.  She wanted to sell me a 23sqm studio at P4.5M.  After listening for a bit, I told her that I wanted to sell my own unit of 22sqm in the very nearby Avida project, and I asked her "what do you think it is worth?"  Suddenly, she wanted to talk about Zonal values.  (And would not discuss yields.)  I asked her: Why is the Zonal valuation relevant for my almost new property, but not for your new property?  She had no answer

Q: Maybe you need to talk to more seasoned brokers.  You might have received a more satisfying answer

A: My second question was:  Why is my already-finished unit, closer to Greenbelt, with furniture inside, and able to earn a good return like 8% or more - Not better in every way than your new project's studio where the buyer will not get a key for some years?  Again, no answer. What would the seasoned guy say in response to these meaningful points?

Q: There are brokers who were licensed for the sale of new projects for developers and there are brokers who became licensed as a profession.  The later should be able to provide more satisfying responses to such questions.

A: She brought up Zonal values only in reaction to my (surprise) question about pricing of the finished nearby project, also by Avida. xx

So... I expect the Seasoned guy would probably just walk away. (haha) And THAT is exactly the problem that intelligent sellers face.  The gap between the primary and secondary market is big and widening, and it is almost like a Taboo subject to talk about it. Agents will not show their buyers the (cheaper) secondary market price when they think they can get an easier commission by selling a more expensive new property.   They pursue their self-interest, not their customers interest.

I still believe that the REAL PRICE is the secondary market price.  In more developed markets like HK everyone knows that.  In PHP people seem to want to pretend that the real price is the developers price, when in reality only developers are able to Sell at those (high) prices. Those who want to resell their condos might get 25-35% less than developer prices.

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Comment: A PRECEDENT? for an effective Portal

I think ten-x commercial is a good site similar to what you’re speaking about. You may need to connect to a US server via VPN to access the site.

Sign up and pretend to be interested in a property- you can see the entire “package of docs” you can download. I can send you a sample for your reference if you have difficulty logging in.

Consists of in-depth knowledge of the area, statistics both good and bad, tenant lease agreement (if unit is tenanted), rent rolls, history of recent repairs made

A: Interesting precedent

[drbubb]

DISCUSSION #2: (On a chat for owners in a particular building - where a 2nd chat was opened to include agents)

I hope we will find agents (on the other chat)  who will support the market in a serious and professional way. Not just try to harvest cheap flats here.

Z: They are the ones working in realities they like getting unit details. I'd receive messages like that, i normally ask if they have a real client or directly talking to one. I chance upon meeting secondary market agents, it's amazing how aggressive everyone is now.

B: They want listings but may have no clients. Many add no value since they are not direct to clients. Those we should weed out. In fact. We may want a portal that has direct access for buyers and sellers. Not just agents

Z: Ideally

B: Not sure if you are aware of CEstates, Z.  But they are working on a platform which may revolutionize the secondary market

Z: Im not but i looked it up. It be great if that would be the future of real estate here. You see one of the challenges in the PH is documentation.  When i was in the US last yr i assisted a successful agent, i noticed how sophisticated the software/system there. They have this MLS (multiple listing service) etc.  I hope PH will have something like that.

B: I own or have owned property in: USA, UK, HK, PHP, & Thailand.  The system in PHP is very primitive and needs change. I have spoken with the Chairman of CEstates and he also believes the market here is primitive and needs to change.  He is open to suggestions from me (and others) about how the new & changed market might look

Z: Yea. You need (a huge) amount of patience here. Cool

B: I am refining a little draft memo about this... to share with CEstates chairman, to see if he will buy into the idea of a slimmed down LOCAL PORTAL.

Top 3 issues: Transparency, Efficiency (shortening chains & reducing cost), Enhanced local knowledge
Foreigners friends have said: "where is the secondary market?  I cannot find it"
Financing issues might be tackled later - once the effort has more credibility

M: tell your friends this: Negligible secondary market because developers are flooding the market with new developments. Buyers inexperienced in the PH market (not PHP, that's the peso) prefer developer direct over fuzzy secondary because it seems so much easier.

B: Maybe...  But I know smart and experienced buyers who want to buy secondhand, and get frustrated using websites like OLX because there are so many "spoof" deals there.  Agents are looking to collect prospect details, and they do not have the properties they advertise.  Sometimes they had them months ago, but they were sold, but they keep ads going as a way of collecting new leads.

Why are (secondary market) deals FUZZY?  New seems Fuzzy to me.  You cannot see what you are buying

M: Common theme is overweening self interest. Now even if you can un-fuzz the secondary market, for as long as developers seem easier to buy from, that's where most of the action will be. Actually savvy secondary buyers have the means (and savvy) to get their deals done.

But still, it's nice for you to keep trying. The freer the market and the more the options, the better for participants, on balance

B: I get your point.  And the whole point of this exercise is to make the Secondary market more transparent ("easier to see"), easier to use, and cheaper to transaction.

M: (New Fuzzy?) Yeah, People get fooled by show flats, scale models, and renderings... which is why I wish you well in this project

B: I think we can find some common purpose in cooperating with people to make the secondary market in our immediate area more efficient.  BTW, I do not think I am alone on this desire

M: Re OLX, I've not met anyone who got a deal done via an agent (though the probably are some). People I know who transacted successfully were direct

B: I have 2-3 friends who found bargains on OLX.  And their experiences are part of the reason I think this project might work

M: I'm not saying olx is a dud or no bargains can be had. Just that it's full of make believe, the way to get a deal there is to work directly with the counterparty, no middleman

B: There were agents involved in two of those OLX deals.  One was a Korean agent for a korean seller at One Central.  The other buyer found a P3Million studio at Asten last July.  In fact, he also found a cheaper one a few weeks earlier, but I talked him out of it, because there was big beam in the unit. haha. 

BTW, I call those make believe listings: "SPOOF" deals... which agents use to harvest buyer interest

M: Korean seller will need an agent. But Pinoys usually won't, unless they're overseas or truly not up to it. Meanwhile, agents like data gathering for their own use. Anyway, secondary is going to stay limited for as long as new inventory keeps coming.

B: I know many who want to buy the Bargains in the 2nd market, but cannot easily find them. I envision HUBS; where someone who wants a Bargain near City Gate would join the Hub, and get a look at the baragins there.  And the interested buyer would communicate with Owners or Agents who have keys. No spoofers

M: An owners and direct buyers site may work. If there are fakes , they get reported and the unit be banned for listing

B: Yup.  That is basically what I have in mind.  But I would allow pre-qualified agents to join too... To widen the marketing effort.

Agents who do not behave properly would get expelled. And the agents would agree to follow "Best Practice", as specified for the Hub

Women used to talk about "taking back the Night."  If we get properly organized, we buyers and sellers, we can "recapture the Market" from the self-interest of Developers and Agents, who think they can trample on the interests of their customers

[drbubb]

NEXT Up : Wish List :  What would be the features of a Local Portal website?

[drbubb]

AIRDROP ! Free Tokens !

CEstates is planning to do a "Free" airdrop of Tokens

Making real estate easy for everyone!

BUY | EARN | SELL
Tokenized Real Estate Platform

You can sign up HERE ... > https://cestates.io/signup

[drbubb]

From THE OUTLOOK, Lamudi's comprehensive look on Philippines Real Estate

ONLINE PORTALS (as reported in 2018)

According to a Paypal study, more and more Filipino's shop online.

From a total online spending of Php 92.5 billion in 2017, an increase of 32% is expected to Php 122 billion. This may be the same reason why there is growth in the e-commerce industry, including the sprouting of several real estate portals.  As a fast-rising platform and a new way of offering land properties to potential buyers, online real estate portals also make presentation, negotiation, and selling easier, as all the information may be accessed with a few clicks.

Online real estate platform Lamudi.com.ph helps property seekers enjoy the convenience of window shopping for available properties for rent or for lease, a house and lot, or condo unit, for business or for residential use, in any area they desire. Chat messaging is available as well, assuring assistance and responses to any queries.

+ Philippines has an internet penetration rate of 63% (67 Million) Filipinos - that was over one year ago, and it will be higher today

+ Filipinos spend an average of 9 hours and 29 minutes online, second only to Thailand at 9 hours, and 38 minutes

+ The government has plans to make the internet more accessible, with WIFI to be available in many public places, like government offices, state universities, hospitals and parks.  They have set up a Free Public Internet Access Fund to finance this

+ E-commerce is a particularly big growth area, with over $2 Billion spent on online shopping in 2017, and growing browsing for things like property searches

+ A challenge is slow internet speeds. The country's average fixed internet speed is just 15.2 MB's per second, well below the global average of 40.7 Mbs.  In 4G technology, Philpipines is way behind, and ranks 74th out of 77 countries surveyed.  Plans are afoot to improve this.  Part of the plan is to bring in a 3rd major internet provider after Globe and SMART, to improve service through greater competition

Pricing comparisons, per Lamudi in the First Half of 2018

Location------------- : CONDO price : RENTAL: Yield/ House price 

Metro Manila----------- : Php 121,821 : Php 832 : 8.20%/ Php 73,178 

Visayas, & Mindanao: Php 112,795 : Php 794 : 8.45%/ Php 52,460

 

[drbubb]

ARE SOME AGENTS HOARDING their secondary market Property Listings?

It seems so.... Here is one theory:

Many do not want ALL BUYERS (& agents for buyers "controlled by" or close to the agents of Other firms)

to see their cheaper properties, because they are hoping  an "inhouse buyer" can be found - so they & colleagues can get the "whole" commission

(Note:  Please tell me, if you think this is wrong.)

[drbubb]

Hi Neighbours,
The wise  among us may not need this advice.

But for the rest of us who failed to stock up food and supplies for a 2 week or longer shutdown,
I want to share my learnings from today.  My neighbourhood near Makati Medical is poorly
Equiped with shopping.  It seems to have been an afterthought for the property developers
Who rushed to put up new Condos.  So I went out this morning for a journey of some hours,
Looking for groceries: canned goods, breakfast food, things like ACV, which I take everyday.
The good news is that “convenience stores” are open.  But when you look at what is actually
On the shelves, it is a huge disappointment.  Over half of the shelf space seems to be given
Over to foods that I consider inedible: potato chips, crisps, sugary delights with zero nutritional
Value that I have (mostly) learned to stop eating years ago,  About the only good things you
Can find at 711, Family Mart, All Day, Lawson etc, are water, corned beef, and some warmed
Up comfort food.  What an indictment of these companies & their low level of respect for
Customers’ true needs.  Fortunately, I found a solution:  Mercury drugs!

They have a large store near me, and inside you can find all the prescription, drugs,
Cosmetic and hair care items that you would expect. And so junk food too. But they actually
Have a few shelves where you can find things like oatmeal, ACV, and honey that may
Sustain a person beyond the first few days of lock down,
I thought I should share this discovery.  Please feel free to share yours too!