Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
drbubb

Gold Bulls - "Clawing the Sky" as prices fall

Recommended Posts

Surely gold has been a currency a lot longer than Jim Sinclair has been alive!!

 

It is 38 years since the gold standard backed paper was dropped I believe, yet when our finest and bravest boys where sent into Iraq behind emeny lines was it gbp the western governments gave them for emergencies or gold coins?

 

Regards

 

ML

 

Currency |ˈkərənsē; ˈkə-rənsē|

noun ( pl. -cies)

1 a system of money in general use in a particular country : the dollar was a strong currency | travelers checks in foreign currency | figurative he was rich in the currency of love.

2 the fact or quality of being generally accepted or in use : since the Gulf War, the term has gained new currency.

• the time during which something is in use or operation : no claim had been made during the currency of the policy.

 

Gold is a currency, and therefore a currency is a system of money in general use?

 

When you obtain currency for travel abroad why does your local money exchange service not offer gold coins?

 

It's because gold is not a currency. Unless you own a goldmine then of course you want people to lap up "Gold is a currency" like a dog drinks water. Jim Sinclair posts pictures of himself playing with puppies on his website. It's an amazing metaphor, he really is an amazing MOPER.

 

 

It's certainly true that 95% of people are docile and led around by the nose by the other 5%

 

Think for yourself

 

If gold is insurance when do you sell it?

 

Answer - Never, therefore what's the point in having it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
:lol: - I really am laughing out loud! I wondered how long it would be before someone came along with that predictable response. I do not have gold fever. I trust my guts more than I trust anything else. Of course I have the ability to reason - and do so but only a fool ignores the wisdom of countless generations.

 

BTW, Do you have any idea where this 'gold fever'comes from?

 

 

It comes from nurturing a love of money (in whatever form) and seeking to possess it as opposed to utilise it. The emotional entanglement with gold which you describe as a "visceral" response has nothing to do with accepting the wisdom of countless generations and everything to do with your personal emotional response to feeling and touching and holding a lump of gold that represents super-condensed monetary worth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sadly, not much looks cheap.

I am nibbling at a few Uranium shares, while thinking they may get hit if stocks selloff.

And I have a similar idea about some food stocks and Corn and Wheat.

Natgas maybe, but there's good reason for it to be cheap.

 

Land and property in Detroit, but I'm not so sure it will come back in 1-2 decades

 

how are your property purchases doing in Germany btw ?

the ones you bought as part of a consortium in 2007 iirc ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It comes from nurturing a love of money (in whatever form) and seeking to possess it as opposed to utilise it. The emotional entanglement with gold which you describe as a "visceral" response has nothing to do with accepting the wisdom of countless generations and everything to do with your personal emotional response to feeling and touching and holding a lump of gold that represents super-condensed monetary worth.

Ouch. Don't be too harsh on us mere mortals. :)

 

"Gold is tried by a touchstone, and men by gold".

 

some ancient greek.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Can't argue with that. Same goes for tulips, myrrh, glass beads, etc...

 

We've been through this before. Yawn. Very few things have the properties suitable to make them useful as money. Gold is one of those things. I can't be bothered to go through the list again as it's been done ad infinitum.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Answer - Never, therefore what's the point in having it

 

Why not ask the bankers/Nations who are currently big buyers?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ouch. Don't be too harsh on us mere mortals. :)

 

"Gold is tried by a touchstone, and men by gold".

 

some ancient greek.

 

 

"A love of money is the root of all evil" - more ancient Greek! (Or might have been Aramaic. If not, Koine Greek).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gold is a currency, and therefore a currency is a system of money in general use?

 

When you obtain currency for travel abroad why does your local money exchange service not offer gold coins?

 

It's because gold is not a currency.

 

Depends which country you are in. In Vietnam, for instance, gold is in current use. Items in shops are frequently priced in gold and you can get gold denominated mortgages. In India and many other countries gold is available over the counter in highstreet banks.

 

Gold is instantly recognised in almost every country and people are prepared to accept it in payment. Gold is the oldest form of money - hard currency - whether you like it or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It comes from nurturing a love of money (in whatever form) and seeking to possess it as opposed to utilise it. The emotional entanglement with gold which you describe as a "visceral" response has nothing to do with accepting the wisdom of countless generations and everything to do with your personal emotional response to feeling and touching and holding a lump of gold that represents super-condensed monetary worth.

 

I think we may be entering the nature vs nurture arena here and that argument never goes anywhere.

 

I am quite aware of the foolishness of expending time and energy to extract gold from the earth - only to lock it up again - but men are foolish and untrustworthy and as long as they are, gold will be money. In a world of perfect men, there would be no prostitution because the sexual urge would be restrained until a loving partner was found and women would not sell themselves. I cannot see prostitution disappearing anytime soon.

 

I am reminded of a Soviet joke about a Westerner in Moscow who asked a policeman what was going on - regarding many women being put into police vans.

 

The man asked if the women were prostitutes. The policeman replied 'in the Soviet Union, the unjust capitalist system that forces women to sell themselves does not exist - we have created a truly just society where men and women share equally in the building of a socialist paradise.'

 

'But who are these women then?' asked the Westerner.

 

'Oh, just some whores we are taking in as part of a crack down on prostitution'

 

:lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Currency |ˈkərənsē; ˈkə-rənsē|

noun ( pl. -cies)

1 a system of money in general use in a particular country : the dollar was a strong currency | travelers checks in foreign currency | figurative he was rich in the currency of love.

2 the fact or quality of being generally accepted or in use : since the Gulf War, the term has gained new currency.

• the time during which something is in use or operation : no claim had been made during the currency of the policy.

 

Gold is a currency, and therefore a currency is a system of money in general use?

 

When you obtain currency for travel abroad why does your local money exchange service not offer gold coins?

 

It's because gold is not a currency. Unless you own a goldmine then of course you want people to lap up "Gold is a currency" like a dog drinks water. Jim Sinclair posts pictures of himself playing with puppies on his website. It's an amazing metaphor, he really is an amazing MOPER.

 

 

It's certainly true that 95% of people are docile and led around by the nose by the other 5%

 

Think for yourself

 

If gold is insurance when do you sell it?

 

Answer - Never, therefore what's the point in having it

 

 

Answer: When you consider conditions have improved so you reduce your amount of cover.

 

That is sell a proportion or all depending on your ongoing perspective.

 

Gold is still accepted everywhere as a store of wealth worldwide.

 

and has been for thousands of years and I can't see that coming to an end soon?

 

 

 

Regards

 

ML.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gold is a currency, and therefore a currency is a system of money in general use?

 

When you obtain currency for travel abroad why does your local money exchange service not offer gold coins?

 

There is a Bureaux de Change in Leadenhall St, London, called City Forex who sell gold, silver bullion bars and coins as well as readies for your hols.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There is a Bureaux de Change in Leadenhall St, London, called City Forex who sell gold, silver bullion bars and coins as well as readies for your hols.

 

Anyone that believes gold is not a currency has obviously never seen the ISO classifications for currencies:

 

http://www.iso.org/iso/support/currency_codes_list-1.htm

 

ISO 4217 currency names and code elements

 

Entity Currency Alphabetic code Numeric code

AFGHANISTAN Afghani AFN 971

ÅLAND ISLANDS Euro EUR 978

ALBANIA Lek ALL 008

ALGERIA Algerian Dinar DZD 012

AMERICAN SAMOA US Dollar USD 840

ANDORRA Euro EUR 978

ANGOLA Kwanza AOA 973

ANGUILLA East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

ANTARCTICA No universal currency

ANTIGUA AND BARBUDA East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

ARGENTINA Argentine Peso ARS 032

ARMENIA Armenian Dram AMD 051

ARUBA Aruban Guilder AWG 533

AUSTRALIA Australian Dollar AUD 036

AUSTRIA Euro EUR 978

AZERBAIJAN Azerbaijanian Manat AZN 944

BAHAMAS Bahamian Dollar BSD 044

BAHRAIN Bahraini Dinar BHD 048

BANGLADESH Taka BDT 050

BARBADOS Barbados Dollar BBD 052

BELARUS Belarussian Ruble BYR 974

BELGIUM Euro EUR 978

BELIZE Belize Dollar BZD 084

BENIN CFA Franc BCEAO † XOF 952

BERMUDA Bermudian Dollar (customarily known as Bermuda Dollar) BMD 060

BHUTAN Indian Rupee

 

Ngultrum INR

 

BTN 356

 

064

BOLIVIA Boliviano

 

Mvdol BOB

 

BOV 068

 

984

BOSNIA AND HERZEGOVINA Convertible Marks BAM 977

BOTSWANA Pula BWP 072

BOUVET ISLAND Norwegian Krone NOK 578

BRAZIL Brazilian Real BRL 986

BRITISH INDIAN OCEAN TERRITORY US Dollar USD 840

BRUNEI DARUSSALAM Brunei Dollar BND 096

BULGARIA Bulgarian Lev BGN 975

BURKINA FASO CFA Franc BCEAO † XOF 952

BURUNDI Burundi Franc BIF 108

CAMBODIA Riel KHR 116

CAMEROON CFA Franc BEAC ‡ XAF 950

CANADA Canadian Dollar CAD 124

CAPE VERDE Cape Verde Escudo CVE 132

CAYMAN ISLANDS Cayman Islands Dollar KYD 136

CENTRAL AFRICAN REPUBLIC CFA Franc BEAC ‡ XAF 950

CHAD CFA Franc BEAC ‡ XAF 950

CHILE Chilean Peso

 

Unidades de fomento CLP

 

CLF 152

 

990

CHINA Yuan Renminbi CNY 156

CHRISTMAS ISLAND Australian Dollar AUD 036

COCOS (KEELING) ISLANDS Australian Dollar AUD 036

COLOMBIA Colombian Peso

 

Unidad de Valor Real COP

 

COU 170

 

970

COMOROS Comoro Franc KMF 174

CONGO CFA Franc BEAC ‡ XAF 950

CONGO, THE DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF Congolese Franc CDF 976

COOK ISLANDS New Zealand Dollar NZD 554

COSTA RICA Costa Rican Colon CRC 188

CÔTE D'IVOIRE CFA Franc BCEAO † XOF 952

CROATIA Croatian Kuna HRK 191

CUBA Cuban Peso

 

Peso Convertible CUP

 

CUC 192

 

931

CYPRUS Euro EUR 978

CZECH REPUBLIC Czech Koruna CZK 203

DENMARK Danish Krone DKK 208

DJIBOUTI Djibouti Franc DJF 262

DOMINICA East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

DOMINICAN REPUBLIC Dominican Peso DOP 214

ECUADOR US Dollar USD 840

EGYPT Egyptian Pound EGP 818

EL SALVADOR El Salvador Colon

 

US Dollar SVC

 

USD 222

 

840

EQUATORIAL GUINEA CFA Franc BEAC ‡ XAF 950

ERITREA Nakfa ERN 232

ESTONIA Kroon EEK 233

ETHIOPIA Ethiopian Birr ETB 230

FALKLAND ISLANDS (MALVINAS) Falkland Islands Pound FKP 238

FAROE ISLANDS Danish Krone DKK 208

FIJI Fiji Dollar FJD 242

FINLAND Euro EUR 978

FRANCE Euro EUR 978

FRENCH GUIANA Euro EUR 978

FRENCH POLYNESIA CFP Franc XPF 953

FRENCH SOUTHERN TERRITORIES Euro EUR 978

GABON CFA Franc BEAC ‡ XAF 950

GAMBIA Dalasi GMD 270

GEORGIA Lari GEL 981

GERMANY Euro EUR 978

GHANA Cedi GHS 936

GIBRALTAR Gibraltar Pound GIP 292

GREECE Euro EUR 978

GREENLAND Danish Krone DKK 208

GRENADA East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

GUADELOUPE Euro EUR 978

GUAM US Dollar USD 840

GUATEMALA Quetzal GTQ 320

GUERNSEY Pound Sterling GBP 826

GUINEA Guinea Franc GNF 324

GUINEA-BISSAU Guinea-Bissau Peso

 

CFA Franc BCEAO † GWP

 

XOF 624

 

952

GUYANA Guyana Dollar GYD 328

HAITI Gourde

 

US Dollar HTG

 

USD 332

 

840

HEARD ISLAND AND MCDONALD ISLANDS Australian Dollar AUD 036

HOLY SEE (VATICAN CITY STATE) Euro EUR 978

HONDURAS Lempira HNL 340

HONG KONG Hong Kong Dollar HKD 344

HUNGARY Forint HUF 348

ICELAND Iceland Krona ISK 352

INDIA Indian Rupee INR 356

INDONESIA Rupiah IDR 360

IRAN, ISLAMIC REPUBLIC OF Iranian Rial IRR 364

IRAQ Iraqi Dinar IQD 368

IRELAND Euro EUR 978

ISRAEL New Israeli Sheqel ILS 376

ITALY Euro EUR 978

JAMAICA Jamaican Dollar JMD 388

JAPAN Yen JPY 392

JERSEY Pound Sterling GBP 826

JORDAN Jordanian Dinar JOD 400

KAZAKHSTAN Tenge KZT 398

KENYA Kenyan Shilling KES 404

KIRIBATI Australian Dollar AUD 036

KOREA, DEMOCRATIC PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF North Korean Won KPW 408

KOREA, REPUBLIC OF Won KRW 410

KUWAIT Kuwaiti Dinar KWD 414

KYRGYZSTAN Som KGS 417

LAO PEOPLE'S DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC Kip LAK 418

LATVIA Latvian Lats LVL 428

LEBANON Lebanese Pound LBP 422

LESOTHO Rand

 

Loti ZAR

 

LSL 710

 

426

LIBERIA Liberian Dollar LRD 430

LIBYAN ARAB JAMAHIRIYA Libyan Dinar LYD 434

LIECHTENSTEIN Swiss Franc CHF 756

LITHUANIA Lithuanian Litas LTL 440

LUXEMBOURG Euro EUR 978

MACAO Pataca MOP 446

MACEDONIA, THE FORMER YUGOSLAV REPUBLIC OF Denar MKD 807

MADAGASCAR Malagasy Ariary MGA 969

MALAWI Kwacha MWK 454

MALAYSIA Malaysian Ringgit MYR 458

MALDIVES Rufiyaa MVR 462

MALI CFA Franc BCEAO † XOF 952

MALTA Euro EUR 978

MARSHALL ISLANDS US Dollar USD 840

MARTINIQUE Euro EUR 978

MAURITANIA Ouguiya MRO 478

MAURITIUS Mauritius Rupee MUR 480

MAYOTTE Euro EUR 978

MEXICO Mexican Peso

 

Mexican Unidad de Inversion (UDI) MXN

 

MXV 484

 

979

MICRONESIA, FEDERATED STATES OF US Dollar USD 840

MOLDOVA, REPUBLIC OF Moldovan Leu MDL 498

MONACO Euro EUR 978

MONGOLIA Tugrik MNT 496

MONTENEGRO Euro EUR 978

MONTSERRAT East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

MOROCCO Moroccan Dirham MAD 504

MOZAMBIQUE Metical MZN 943

MYANMAR Kyat MMK 104

NAMIBIA Rand

 

Namibia Dollar ZAR

 

NAD 710

 

516

NAURU Australian Dollar AUD 036

NEPAL Nepalese Rupee NPR 524

NETHERLANDS Euro EUR 978

NETHERLANDS ANTILLES Netherlands Antillian Guilder ANG 532

NEW CALEDONIA CFP Franc XPF 953

NEW ZEALAND New Zealand Dollar NZD 554

NICARAGUA Cordoba Oro NIO 558

NIGER CFA Franc BCEAO † XOF 952

NIGERIA Naira NGN 566

NIUE New Zealand Dollar NZD 554

NORFOLK ISLAND Australian Dollar AUD 036

NORTHERN MARIANA ISLANDS US Dollar USD 840

NORWAY Norwegian Krone NOK 578

OMAN Rial Omani OMR 512

PAKISTAN Pakistan Rupee PKR 586

PALAU US Dollar USD 840

PANAMA Balboa

 

US Dollar PAB

 

USD 590

 

840

PAPUA NEW GUINEA Kina PGK 598

PARAGUAY Guarani PYG 600

PERU Nuevo Sol PEN 604

PHILIPPINES Philippine Peso PHP 608

PITCAIRN New Zealand Dollar NZD 554

POLAND Zloty PLN 985

PORTUGAL Euro EUR 978

PUERTO RICO US Dollar USD 840

QATAR Qatari Rial QAR 634

RÉUNION Euro EUR 978

ROMANIA New Leu RON 946

RUSSIAN FEDERATION Russian Ruble RUB 643

RWANDA Rwanda Franc RWF 646

SAINT-BARTHÉLEMY Euro EUR 978

SAINT HELENA Saint Helena Pound SHP 654

SAINT KITTS AND NEVIS East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

SAINT LUCIA East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

SAINT MARTIN Euro EUR 978

SAINT PIERRE AND MIQUELON Euro EUR 978

SAINT VINCENT AND THE GRENADINES East Caribbean Dollar XCD 951

SAMOA Tala WST 882

SAN MARINO Euro EUR 978

SÃO TOME AND PRINCIPE Dobra STD 678

SAUDI ARABIA Saudi Riyal SAR 682

SENEGAL CFA Franc BCEAO † XOF 952

SERBIA Serbian Dinar RSD 941

SEYCHELLES Seychelles Rupee SCR 690

SIERRA LEONE Leone SLL 694

SINGAPORE Singapore Dollar SGD 702

SLOVAKIA Euro EUR 978

SLOVENIA Euro EUR 978

SOLOMON ISLANDS Solomon Islands Dollar SBD 090

SOMALIA Somali Shilling SOS 706

SOUTH AFRICA Rand ZAR 710

SPAIN Euro EUR 978

SRI LANKA Sri Lanka Rupee LKR 144

SUDAN Sudanese Pound SDG 938

SURINAME Surinam Dollar SRD 968

SVALBARD AND JAN MAYEN Norwegian Krone NOK 578

SWAZILAND Lilangeni SZL 748

SWEDEN Swedish Krona SEK 752

SWITZERLAND Swiss Franc

 

WIR Franc

 

WIR Euro CHF

 

CHW

 

CHE 756

 

948

 

947

SYRIAN ARAB REPUBLIC Syrian Pound SYP 760

TAIWAN, PROVINCE OF CHINA New Taiwan Dollar TWD 901

TAJIKISTAN Somoni TJS 972

TANZANIA, UNITED REPUBLIC OF Tanzanian Shilling TZS 834

THAILAND Baht THB 764

TIMOR-LESTE US Dollar USD 840

TOGO CFA Franc BCEAO † XOF 952

TOKELAU New Zealand Dollar NZD 554

TONGA Pa'anga TOP 776

TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO Trinidad and Tobago Dollar TTD 780

TUNISIA Tunisian Dinar TND 788

TURKEY Turkish Lira TRY 949

TURKMENISTAN Manat TMT 934

TURKS AND CAICOS ISLANDS US Dollar USD 840

TUVALU Australian Dollar AUD 036

UGANDA Uganda Shilling UGX 800

UKRAINE Hryvnia UAH 980

UNITED ARAB EMIRATES UAE Dirham AED 784

UNITED KINGDOM Pound Sterling GBP 826

UNITED STATES US Dollar

 

US Dollar (Same day)

 

US Dollar (Next day) USD

 

USS

 

USN 840

 

998

 

997

UNITED STATES MINOR OUTLYING ISLANDS US Dollar USD 840

URUGUAY Peso Uruguayo

 

Uruguay Peso en Unidades Indexadas UYU

 

UYI 858

 

940

UZBEKISTAN Uzbekistan Sum UZS 860

VANUATU Vatu VUV 548

VENEZUELA Bolivar Fuerte VEF 937

VIET NAM Dong VND 704

VIRGIN ISLANDS (BRITISH) US Dollar USD 840

VIRGIN ISLANDS (U.S.) US Dollar USD 840

WALLIS AND FUTUNA CFP Franc XPF 953

WESTERN SAHARA Moroccan Dirham MAD 504

YEMEN Yemeni Rial YER 886

ZAMBIA Zambian Kwacha ZMK 894

ZIMBABWE Zimbabwe Dollar ZWL 932

Gold XAU 959

Bond Markets Units European Composite Unit (EURCO) XBA 955

European Monetary Unit (E.M.U.-6) XBB 956

European Unit of Account 9(E.U.A.-9) XBC 957

European Unit of Account 17(E.U.A.-17) XBD 958

INTERNATIONAL MONETARY FUND (I.M.F) SDR XDR 960

Palladium XPD 964

Platinum XPT 962

Silver XAG 961

Special settlement currencies

UIC-Franc XFU Nil

Codes specifically reserved for testing purposes XTS 963

The codes assigned for transactions where no currency is involved are: XXX 999

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There is a Bureaux de Change in Leadenhall St, London, called City Forex who sell gold, silver bullion bars and coins as well as readies for your hols.

There's a forex company in Helsinki which sells gold bars and coins (not silver, though).

http://www.tavex.fi/?lang=eng

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On the Gold thread, complacency rules !

 

Wow!

What a clear statement of complacency!

(Nothing personal in this, but I think this is very dangerous thinking.)

There may be a huge, huge volume of hedgie selling in the days to come.

The ocean may be pushing through the straw in the opposite direction.

 

It's just the other currencies on the usdx going down Bubb, not the dollar going up.

 

They will all end up going down v Gold/Silver, bit by bit, don't you worry about that!

 

You really should keep your PM''s bashing to the trading thread because you are creating a lot if 'noise'.

 

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premature_ejaculation ;)

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
"A love of money is the root of all evil" - more ancient Greek! (Or might have been Aramaic. If not, Koine Greek).

Yes, gettng at the same idea as the other saying.

 

As you said in an earlier post, gold is the representation of monetary value [which is definitely an improvement of the goldbug's "gold and only gold is money"]. Money takes many different forms... and the vice identified with money [perhaps inappropriately on an investment forum], to which holders of money can become susceptible, is not peculiar to holders of gold but to anyone with money of any sort. That someone sets about accumulating gold or pounds wouldn't say much about whether they had fallen victim to the vice, but could just instead be saying they had succumbed to the virtue of saving [another vice to a certain breed of economists]. If the accumulation is saving towards some future goal, then money would be just a mere means to an end, and not an end in itself.... as it is to lovers of money.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It's just the other currencies on the usdx going down Bubb, not the dollar going up.

???

 

A currency's value is determined in relation to other currencies and commodities.

The dollar ruled almost all last Friday, except a few stocks, but even these peaked early in the day.

 

This is the mistake the Pied Piper makes.

He thinks the dollar is weak, but forgets all the other currencies.

 

The Euro, Yen, and Sterling can all be weaker than the Dollar.

And if they are, the trade-weighted dollar will rise, and attract some money, even away from Gold.

It may be temporary, but the gold price can take a big tumble anyway. As it did last year.

 

I am a patient gold investor, far more patient than the Pied Piper.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
???

 

A currency's value is determined in relation to other currencies and commodities.

The dollar ruled almost all last Friday, except a few stocks, but even these peaked early in the day.

 

This is the mistake the Pied Piper makes.

He thinks the dollar is weak, but forgets all the other currencies.

 

The Euro, Yen, and Sterling can all be weaker than the Dollar.

And if they are, the trade-weighted dollar will rise, and attract some money, even away from Gold.

It may be temporary, but the gold price can take a big tumble anyway. As it did last year.

 

I am a patient gold investor, far more patient than the Pied Piper.

 

Be right sit tight is a kind of patience too.

 

I believe Orlov's, Cgnao's and Martenson's take on it may be right.

 

Trading is a skill I do not have or wish to aquire, novices lose money and you have to be good really good to make profit; I have a job that takes most of my energy and time and makes good money.

 

I think that gold will never be the dog of an investment it was in the 80's and 90's unless the financial system is fixed.

 

If the system is fixed and assuming then government promises are not broken I will be OK even if gold goes to £0.

 

In short gold is insurance for me and it does look more than possible I will need that insurance.

 

Even though I am 50% in gold and silver I do not really have much joy when the price goes up - that's because that is a sign that cg and the others are right.

 

We have peak oil, the biggest ever credit bubble collapsing , a looming demographic crisis, unknown problems with a fiat reserve currency thats in trouble and useless authorities delaying problems with tactics that will just to make them worse later.

 

Samuel Johnson sums it up for me - "those that have gold are in fear those without it are in danger"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes, gettng at the same idea as the other saying.

 

As you said in an earlier post, gold is the representation of monetary value [which is definitely an improvement of the goldbug's "gold and only gold is money"]. Money takes many different forms... and the vice identified with money [perhaps inappropriately on an investment forum], to which holders of money can become susceptible, is not unique to holders of gold but to anyone with money of any sort. That someone set about accumulating gold or pounds wouldn't say much about whether they had fallen victim to the vice, but could just instead be saying they had succumbed to the virtue of saving [ a vice to a certain breed of economists]. If the accumulation is saving towards some future goal, then money would be just a mere means to an end, and not an end in itself.... as it is to lovers of money.

 

 

Yes, these are fine lines we attempt to draw between endeavours which at first glance appear identical: saving and hoarding. I suppose that motive is all....

 

But gold does seem to offer greater opportunities for developing a hoarding mentality than do paper currencies and financial instruments which I think could have something to do with the tactile response it seems to invoke in the holder. I mean, when did you last stroke a wad of tenners?!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is the mistake the Pied Piper makes.

He thinks the dollar is weak, but forgets all the other currencies.

 

I am a patient gold investor, far more patient than the Pied Piper.

 

LOL! I'm sorry but this is just nonsense. Sinclair makes no mistake. You really think the best gold trader of his generation is not patient or is unable to understand the interaction of currencies?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LOL! I'm sorry but this is just nonsense. Sinclair makes no mistake. You really think the best gold trader of his generation is not patient or is unable to understand the interaction of currencies?

I think we are getting the glimpse here that the good Dr B is more than capable of doing the types of things to others that he hates to see done to himself. Mockery and making purile pictures of others? Dear oh dear not good form. You call this type of thing debate? And not combative? Please! Buy hey its "his" site so he is free to do what ever he likes.

 

Actually most stuff until recently has been hugely valuable to me and for that I am very grateful. I know Bubb has come in for a lot of unwarranted abuse from others here of late but I also think it is right and proper that these "excesses" of his own be highlighted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dont count on it, GF. You should be so lucky

 

I made a 300% return on my UK property. Sold it, and but the money into Gold shares.

where I made about 400% profit before many here even got onboard the bus.

 

I dont mind getting out early, so long as I find something else that is truly cheap.

That sounds great, but if you had held on to UK property till 2007 and then sold and then waited to mop up PM stocks after the crash then you would have done even better.

 

My pm stocks are up over 500% this year alone!!! My Uk property was up 400% since 2000 alone.

 

So whilst you think you have played a blinder I am afraid that since 2000 there was a better way to play it.

 

I am not suggesting for a moment that you have done badly but you never seem to ackowledge any other strategy I believe my one was superior to yours and my 500%+ in a little over six months is a stellar return.

 

I personally was not interested in buying gold stocks during the property boom as I could not get leverage in them nor fashion them into a comfortable abode for me and my familly.

 

They were always going to crash PM stocks thatis along with all other stocks my only surprise was by how much of a bargain they became.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes, these are fine lines we attempt to draw between endeavours which at first glance appear identical: saving and hoarding. I suppose that motive is all....

 

But gold does seem to offer greater opportunities for developing a hoarding mentality than do paper currencies and financial instruments which I think could have something to do with the tactile response it seems to invoke in the holder. I mean, when did you last stroke a wad of tenners?!

Interesting point you raise. We often talk about the need for balanced trade. I wonder if a "balance" in money is also required. I don't mean in a golden mean moralist sort of way, but more in an economic sense. What works as money was classically and practically defined as that which performs the function of not only a means of exchange, but also a measure and store of value.

 

In our ultra modern world, where economic growth is pursued for its own sake, the function of the means of exchange was taken to the nth degree to the detriment of its function as a measure and store of value. Because of this, consumers didn't find the need to save, indeed were discouraged from saving... it was like controlled inflation became the norm... for CB's at a conscious level, for consumers at a subconscious level.... so the idea was to spend, consume and borrow, then watch your assets inflate in value.

 

I think this is the fundamental flaw to what is essentially the modern economist's view of money. They have a purely "external" view of money which leads to a mechanical and "quantitative" theory of money [which is hopelessly inadequate as deflationary periods have shown, where "internal" psychology/ behaviour/ practice trumps theory]. A monetary system will not work for long without the counter-balancing "qualitative" aspect, where the earners of money rightly value it and balance the worth of keeping it for a future good/ purchase against buying present goods and services.

 

Unless money is considered valuable in its own right, or a "store" of value [a stable value not necessarily intrinsic value] then the balance will be lost between the exchange and value components [public and private?]. On the one hand, you'll have people only too quick and willing to part with their money, as it swings one way, and then on the other hand, or at a later date, unwilling to part with their money and come to value it too much [hoard]. I'd suggest something like this has happened to our economy/ monetary system as it has gone from inflation to deflation. As economic agents seek liquidity, they will deprive the economy of liquidity. What a pickle eh.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Interesting point you raise. We often talk about the need for balanced trade. I wonder if a "balance" in money is also required. I don't mean in a golden mean moralist sort of way, but more in an economic sense. What works as money was classically and practically defined as that which performs the function of not only a means of exchange, but also a measure and store of value.

 

In our ultra modern world, where economic growth is pursued for its own sake, the function of the means of exchange was taken to the nth degree to the detriment of its function as a measure and store of value. Because of this, consumers didn't find the need to save, indeed were discouraged from saving... it was like controlled inflation became the norm... for CB's at a conscious level, for consumers at a subconscious level.... so the idea was to spend, consume and borrow, then watch your assets inflate in value.

 

I think this is the fundamental flaw to what is essentially the modern economist's view of money. They have a purely "external" view of money which leads to a mechanical and "quantitative" theory of money [which is hopelessly inadequate as deflationary periods have shown, where "internal" psychology/ behaviour/ practice trumps theory]. A monetary system will not work for long without the counter-balancing "qualitative" aspect, where the earners of money rightly value it and balance the worth of keeping it for a future good/ purchase against buying present goods and services.

 

Unless money is considered valuable [a stable value not necessarily intrinsic value] in its own right then the balance will be lost between the exchange and value components. On the one hand, you'll have people only to quick and willing to part with their money, as it swings one way, and then on the other hand, or at a later date, unwilling to part with their money and come to value it too much [hoard]. I'd suggest something like this has happened to our economy/ monetary system as it has gone from inflation to deflation.... and as economic agents seek liquidity, they will deprive the economy of liquidity. What a pickle eh.

 

 

Yes, I think you're right.

 

The current view that "a little bit of inflation is a good thing" is a large part of the problem, imo. Surely, any inflation should always be an evil best avoided; for one, it is a stealth tax and for another, as you suggest, it tends to skew people's psychology concerning money and thus their behaviour.

 

I don't know the exact figures but I believe there was a period of circa 100 years in Britian where we had total financial stability and money kept its value. Perhaps that was to do with the gold standard, though.

 

And, of course, government borrowing for consumption against future taxation plays a large part in economic and monetary instability. Without the discipline of a gold standard, it is all too easy for governments to spend now on vote-catching policies and devalue future repayment through deliberately promoting "a little bit of inflation". And where the government leads, the consumer follows.

 

And borrowing to consume is like riding a tiger - once started it is extremely difficult to stop.

 

We have, as individuals and a nation, become accustomed to eating our seed-corn and cadging off future generations for the wherewithal to plant next year's crop. In the long term, famine/dearth is always the result of such short-sightedness.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's fine to have paper currency but the rate of money supply increase has to be capped at 2% a year AND NO MORE.

 

Unfortunately the people in charge have shown themselves to be incapable of this self-regulation. They've been increasing the money supply at percentages in the teens for years. Decades even.

 

The closing of the gold window in the 1970's spelled the death knell for the dollar. It's only a matter of time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×