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TIPS: Choosing a Condo to Rent (or to Buy) in Makati

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Makati Tips: Choosing a Condo to Rent (or to Buy)

How to find, buy or rent the ideal Condo in Makati


(When we have more members living in and near Makati, I plan to run a poll here)

Meantime, I would like to ask those who are living in the Philippines to join the discussion.

/ You can Join GEI : HERE : see post #2 /

To start with,

We can talk about the ideal condo TO RENT.

Later on, we can discuss the ideal condo TO BUY..

(only if we understand the needs of renters, can we make solid decisions about what to buy for investment.)

There seem to be two main category of renters, those looking to use it as :

+ A Work Pad :

Those who have another property, further away (in the provinces), and need a "pad" near their place of work,

so that they can have an easier and shorter commute for each day of work. They may return to their provincial home on the weekend.

Obviously, a work pad can be smaller, because the tenants only needs some clothes for work, and a place to sleep

+ A MAIN Home :

Those whose only, or whose principle property will be the one that they are seeking to rent, and live in.

I can also imagine that there will be many people, who will start out renting a WP (Work pad), possibly on a shared basis, and will later decide they want to live permanently in the Makati area, and will seek a (larger) Main home property. They will be seen as trading up from perhaps a studio to 1BR, or 2BR flat,

For mass demand, absorbing all those small flats being built:

There may also be young people who work in a call center, working peculiar hours (not 9am to 5pm) and have a home in the provinces where their parents life. These people may have a WP type flat, but want to live a "full" Life from it, while they are in Makati

LINK to here : http://tinyurl.com/Makati-TIPS
Other notes- : soho-lay : both : mo-lay : weebly :

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Top Posters In This Topic

On this thread, we will also talk about what BUYERS are looking for in Makati condos.

I have noticed that there are several very active threads on Skyscraper City.com about condos presently under-construction in Makati:

> SSC-Makati : http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1274

It seems that OFW's (and others) who have bought condos in Makati, use these threads, and the photos they include as a way to monitor the progress on properties they have purchased, or are considering for purchase.

The most active Makati Condo threads on SSC are as of : FEB. 2016 :

TOP 10 CONDOS, by Hits :

+ Jazz Residences.... ( 3,971 replies - 786.5k views)
+ Trump Tower ......... ( 2,382 replies - 503.6k v / Stratford Res ( 1,533 r - 375.4k v) / Knightsbridge (completed)
+ The Beacon ........... ( 1,923 replies - 394.7k views)
+ San Lorenzo Place ( 1,646 replies - 336.0k views)
+ Park Terraces ....... ( 1,057 replies - 254.7k v) / Garden Twrs ( 377 r - 100.4k)
+ The Rise ... / fb ..... ( 1,180 replies - 287.9k v) / Air Residence ( 335 r - 90.0k)
+ The Proscenium... ( 0,994 replies - 262.3k views)
+ Circuit Makati ...... ( 0,844 replies - 200.5k v) / Solstice ( 127 r - 28.0k
+ Avida San Lorenzo ( 0,792 replies - 167.8k views)
+ Linear .................... ( 0,728 repiles - 158.9k views)


San Lorenzo Place is next to the MRT (Magallanes station) : MRT-Map-large

+ The Lerato ..................... ( 665 replies - 158.4k views)
+ Citygate ......................... ( 273 replies - 67,555 v) / Kroma ( 258 r - 75.8k v) / AFT ( 277 r - 62.0k v)
+ Shang Salcedo .............. ( 580 replies - 158.0k views)
+ Alphaland Makati Tower ( 435 replies - 126,019 views)
+ Eton Tower ................... ( 325 replies - 108,000 views)
+ Brio Tower .....................( 508 replies - 97,245 views)
+ Two & Three Central .....( 324 replies - 95,671 v) / One Central ( 1,500 r - 300k v) :

/ Outside Makati /
+ Light Resid., Manda. .... ( 5,400 r - 923k v.) : Mandayulong (Boni station, on MRT)
+ Flare Towers, Manda. ... ( 5,300 r - 853k v.) : Mandayulong (Boni station)

Properties that are completed are moved to another section of SSC

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One of the key factors to consider when Renting or Buying is AFFORDABILITY.


> see Database for Historical Prices on : http://tinyurl.com/PHP-makati

Gains for ---- : q4-2004 : q4-2007: q4-2015 : '04 >'15 : Ave.% / '07>'15 : Ave.%

Makati Condo : P67,840 : P95,000 : 151,000 : +122.6%: 1.84% / +58.95%: 1.56%
Makati Rent-- : P ??? /m : P 539/m : P 883/m : + N./A + : + n/a +/ +63.82%: 1.58%
Price Inflation- : 100.00 i : 115.95 i : 164.50 i : + 64.0% : 1.13% / +41.44%: 1.09%

The more rapid increase in property prices (beyond CPI price inflation) has been aided by falling interest rates.


Affordability of the RENT to the tenant is a major issue driving Yields & Investment Returns

And also, what sort of Tenant or Buyer the Condo for are looking at is targeting.


LET's START : by looking at the Lower End ... the Mass Demand for all those small flats under construction...

With so many offices in the BPO / Call Centre field, it is important to know how much income workers in that sector learn

Average and Median Monthly Salary Comparison in Philippines in Customer Service and Call Center
Maximum: 183,333 PHP
Average:     31,647 PHP
Median :     22,000 PHP
Minimum :   8,000 PHP

> http://www.salaryexplorer.com/salary-survey.php?loc=171&loctype=1&jobtype=1&job=19

The median for Makati (alone) should be much higher than that PHP 22,000 for the Philippines as a whole.

And the Makati Median should be at or above the Average of 31,647 PHP

If we assume P 30,000 is an average salary for Makati-based call center workers

- then two workers sharing, may be able to afford a Php 20,000 studio (1/3 of their combined salary).

And the better-paid workers may be able to afford a better or larger flat.


Studios above P20-25,000 per month would require more than two people, or better paying jobs

But I think this shows that as long as the BPI job market in Makati remains strong and growing,

you are not going to see many decent condos - including studios renting below Php 20,000 per month.

===== =====

LOOKING BACK : Comment made at the Q2- 2009 Low:

"Residential sales for new and pre-selling developments started to pick up in 2Q09.
But secondary market residential sales are still sluggish. There is a strong preference for newer developments and this has kept the number of transactions in the secondary residential market slow. Nevertheless, implied prices of luxury residential condominiums in Makati CBD were still flat at P101,000/sqm.
Prices of pre-selling condominiums have are testing the 120,000- 130,000/sqm level, the most expensive being the ultra-luxury residential developments. The reason why condominium prices are holding up is because Makati remains an attractive market for investors who are buying units to be rented out. With no new developments to be completed this year, capital values are expected to decrease by a mere 1% over the next twelve (12) months"

> source Q2-2009: Colliers: http://www.bpap.org/bpap/publications/Knowledge%20July%202009.pdf

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VALUATION of Condos can be tricky in an illiquid market

Discussing valuations is something we can do on this thread also

As an example:

On 2/8/2016 at 9:45 PM, DrBubb said:

Eventually, we may want talk about what BUYERS look for in Makati condos.

> SSC-Makati : http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1274

It seems that OFW (and others) who have bought condos in Makati, uses these threads, and the photos they include as a way to monitor the progress on properties they have purchased, or are considering for purchase.

The Lerato ( 665 replies - 158,421 views)


Construction at Lerato . Flats in Tower 1 are being handed over

LERATO - a pretty bold asking price?
"Selling a 31sqm studio unit with parking at tower 1 of Lerato. Fully furnished with top notch appliances. All for 5.5M neg.

Message me if interested. It's fully paid also with clean title."
- H. (02/08/2016) > SSC
Considering it may have had a cost of: P-3.1mn + 400k for furnishing = P-3.5mn
This is a pretty bold asking price... though it does include parking.
P- 5.5mn / 31 = 177.4k psm
Is Lerato really fetching such a price now?
If you estimate the parking space is worth, 900k, then:
P- 5.5mn -0.9 = 4.6mn / 31 = 148.4k psm

As a comparison; an alternative flat For Sale was posted a few weeks ago

"RFO studio for sale, P3.5M fixed."
.PM me.or call 09189282974
- O. (01/19/2016) > SSC (on the same page)
P- 3.5mn / 31? = 112.9k psm

These huge differences are typical of a non-transparent and illiquid market, where bids, offers, and recent transactions are not well known.

I expect the huge gap is the difference between someone trying to cash a decent profit at P-148k psf and a keen seller (distressed seller?) at P-113k psm.

THAT IS A BIG GAP ! (113k / 148k : 76% > 24% less)
If people were better informed, and it was easy to view, buy, and finance flats in the Philippines, then that gap would narrow.

Perhaps over the life of this thread, and this website, we will see a substantial narrowing of the valuation gap.

And GEI and its readers will play some role in helping the gap to narrow

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  • 4 weeks later...

JAZZ .... Does it live up to its online popularity?

Jazz Residences has the most popular thread on SSC - But what is it like as a place to live?


The Pool at Jazz

I visited 2-3 flats there late in 2015. I was impressed with the lobby, and also the amenities.

In fact, i had a very positive opinion... Until I saw the actual flats.


I was not keen on the layouts of the 1BR flats.

The Bedroom part was right next the window, and the living room area was in the middle of the space, without a view, except though the bedroom. The main problem, which blocked the light, was the partition separating the bedroom from the living room area. If I lived there, i would not want to spend much time in the flat except when I was sleeping - the LR seemed like a hallway, and claustrophobic. (I should say, this is a personal opinion, which maybe others may not share,)


Having said this, the suggested Rental prices looked reasonable for 1 BR flats, in the location.

Here's another opinion - this is from SSC - but keep in mind, it comes from an owner of another property, not a Jazz owner:

Posted : September 29th, 2015

by R. L.

I am renting out my unit to a Singapore expat. my other friend is renting his one to a Malaysian expat.
for renters working in RCBC, GT International and other offices in this part of Ayala, they prefer Oriental Gardens Makati than say Jazz.
Jazz which commands the same price but so much inferior in terms of quality, unit size and location. personally I was satisfied with my unit when it was delivered. and i was particularly impressed with the toilet tiling and finishings. so much better than my experience with smdc, dmci and avida. overall i did not have any major issues with my punchlist. my only complaint was with the elevator layout. and sometimes i wish i got a bigger unit from the beginning. sayang kasi it was still well priced during pre selling

S.C. - owner at Jazz:


Originally Posted by Bso. viewpost.gif
does anyone know for sure how many years warranty is there from turnover date? poor workmanship are now starting to appear i heard.

I was told by the former property manager that it was 6 months, but when I accompanied my friend for her turn-over, the SMDC rep said it was one year.
In any event, 18 months after the turn-over of my Tower A unit, I can see defects such as creaking tiles and grout powder coming out of my floor both in my living room and my bedroom. The funny thing is, nobody has lived in my unit. I only get to visit it for an hour every month when I pay my dues. So I can't attribute the problem to wear and tear. I have a good mind to change the whole flooring but the property manager is charging P30k as major renovation bond plus P3k admin fee. (A minor renovation like the installation of a split-type ACU is P10k bond plus P1k admin fee.) They will only return the bond after the work but keep the admin fee for themselves.

/ 3 / : October 12th, 2015

B. L. / Re : Tower C and Tower B

Originally Posted by Homerjkev viewpost.gif
Not moved in yet to my unit in C Tower. Can anyone tell me how do you reach your tower from the street level? Only one point of entry around Jazz? I'm presuming that you enter from street level and take a certain lifts up to the accommodation towers? How secure is this.. is the lift coded in anyway to your key? Many thanks..

The entrance to tower c is at the back ....
Actually am renting a unit at tower c ,I like the ambience ,, and the unit inside is nice facing amenities and makati skyline ... The only drawback is just the entrance but overall is a thumbs up... Am here waiting for the turnover of my unit at tower B ...I felt tower B unit owners were shortchanged compared to tower c but maybe SMDC balanced it out ...my unit at tower B facing makati skyline... My split type AC is 1/5 hp for a 32 sqm ..tower c is 2 hp for a 28 sqm.. Tower b has only 1 smoke detector in the living room ... Tower c have 2 SD , in the LR and the BR...

At tower c you can enjoy the Balcony for relaxation because the AC BLOWER is facing out of the balcony while in my unit at tower b the hot air blows towards the balcony NOT out of the balcony... So I need to shut off my AC , had to wait for half hour for the hot air from my AC BLOWER to dissipate before I could use my balcony....

The only plus of Tower b is the LOBBY .It's just like a five star hotel.. And the pick up drop off point of tower b entrance is well laid out.... But over all like Staff ... Security visibility banana.gif ,, you'll feel very safe... The area is quiet... Garbage is collected 3x a day....

Overall Jazz Condo setting is just like a hotel... All the basics needs of traveling people or tenants are here...

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ROCKWELL - one of the Top 10:

+ The Proscenium .( 0,994 replies - 262.3k views)


The online tours are getting slicker:

"...a virtual tour of the model units for towers Kirov and Sakura.
Allow one to experience and visualize the layout and finishes of one of the units from the said towers."
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Manila REI group - LINK

// how to join GEI (this forum) : see Post#2 : clue; "admiral b*rd" (use a Y, not an I)


Group Photo

Well done to I.M. in starting this group, Manila R.E.I.

This group is growing nicely, and reflects the desire of investors to be well-informed, and

communicating collegially about Real Estate opportunities on their doorstep.

People interested in making money in property investing may want to listen to the introduction to the

Big Three Property principles discussed in this video:


Intro : What are the Three main drivers of Property Prices? :: More Global REO Videos

Something to think about:
The data I have collected shows:
The average (3BR) Condo in Makati has a yield of 7.02%
(at 4Q/2015):

> source of yield estimate

How does that compare with actual Mortgage interest rates - & where are interest rates headed?


If interest rates should go down, don't you think yields (Rents) will fall too, especially since there are so many new condos under construction?

On the other hand, there are may people who might want to move into a flat in Makati, if Rents came lower.

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(here are some comments I received by email):


Kroma going up - with Alveo Financial Tower (Jaka) to the left - in the Heart of the emerging City Gate complex

Kroma can be positive and negative, since it's in the center of everything. neg - I think it will be a bit crowded and noisy? good for single expats living but not family type. Positive - definitely a good investment since the price will increase after all office buildings and entertainment center finish.
Lerato is a bit outside the center but not too far so I think it's great, perfect for family like me. But we are still thinking whether to take it or not, as only 2 beds available right now on tower 2. And I really like legazpi area side.
As of now, I will not consider Circuit, I can't remember the price per sqm. Setting aside the price, that place will take a while to get developed. Considering there are still a lot of units available in Makati, I won't invest in there. I am not yet convinced that it will be a great investment.
We went to view a couple of old condos in legazpi and Salcedo area like one legazpi park, senta, antel platinum etc... we are debating whether we should take old condo or new ones. Old condo is cheaper but need to do a lot of renovation while new condo looks great but price is higher.
(I was asked for comments, and responded as follows):
I too am intrigued by the idea of buying an older condo - if they are cheap enough.
When we first went to Makati to look at property, that was over two years ago, we thought it might be possible to see some older properties - in the same way that it is possible and easy to view older properties in Hong Kong. We thought we might find an estate agent, walk-in, and within a few minutes view some older properties within walking distance of that agent. I'm not sure why, but it doesn't seem to be possible to do that in Makati, or anywhere in Greater Manila. You might get a viewing of a flat or two if you have an appointment, but that might take days to arrange.
(Part of me wonders if there might be a business opportunity inherent in this lack of agents-sitting in shopfront offfices who hold keys for nearby properties to rent or to buy. As you know, it is easy to find those sorts of agents in Hong Kong. Centaline, Midland, Ricacorp, etc are everywhere - and they charge a reasonable 1% on both sides for their service in selling flats, and 1/2 month on each side for rentals.)
Instead, I searched on the web, to get an idea of prices, and walked around to see what areas I would consider living in. I also spoke to friends from HK who had moved to Philippines. I realized that if I moved to Manila, and made some contacts, then if I was patient enough ... Over some weeks or months I might hear of a bargain, view the flat, and buy something that was a genuine bargain. But I might have to look at a dozen or more older buildings before I saw something I wanted to buy.
The alternative of buying a new property still under-construction seemed better for me. That way, I could get a new property without hidden flaws, have some choice of which apartment I bought, and also have no worries over the issue of getting clean title to my property.
I also learned that there were a small handful of developers who had a reputation of delivering a good quality product on time, and in good finished condition. Also very important to me was the quality of Property Management AFTER completion. (I heard some horror stories about properties that lost value after purchase because they were not well managed - maybe public areas looked shabby, and/or they had problems like garbage that could be smelled throughout the building.)
After some research, I learned that (ALI) Ayalaland's branded affiliates - that's Alaya Premier, Alveo, and Avida - were the best known of those developers that had a top class reputation. And, funnily enough, their prices were not much higher than the competition. The main things that ALI did was different from their competition was that they required larger payments and sooner, than some other developers. Also, they did not allow flipping by their customers prior to completion. This may cut into sales a bit, but it also means that ALI's properties go into the hands of long term holders who are financially capable. There are very unlikely to be panicky sellers of any ALI properties under construction. If there are people with financial issues, the properties revert to ALI, rather than showing up in the secondary market at distressed prices. This stability should be good for the owners of properties in Ayala projects.
I am now happy I bought two years ago. Prices then were maybe 10-15% lower than they are today, and I got the property that I wanted - Mine is on the 4X th floor with an open view. It may not be easy to get the same flat after completion in the secondary market, even if I pay was willing to pay the full market price. The better flats on higher floors might rarely come onto the market. I haven't decided yet whether I want to live in it, or rent it out. But like you, I think the completion of high class office buildings as Citygate (including Alveo Financial Tower, AFT) should enhance the demand for my property, if I decide to rent it out.
Apart for lack of choice, and quality of management, another thing to think about in the older buildings, is the amenities. I got spoiled in my prior property in HK - the one I sold in Sept, of last year. We had nice amenities, like a swimming pool (including a small one indoors), a cafe, a library, a computer room, as was as a gym, sauna, and steam room. Few properties in Makati have anything close to that, especially in the older condos. Kroma (with 821 units) has most of these facilities, and Lerato (with over 1,200 units) has even more - Probably the Best Amenities of any condo in Makati !
I hope this is useful, and provides some food for thought.
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I did an interview today with Ramon King of ALVEO

(This is at a very basic level - for foreigners just beginning to look at property investing in the Philippines)

Makati-1 : Ramon King of ALVEO talks about the basics for foreign buyers

A conversation to help foreigns, and especially those in Hong Kong gain a basic introduction to the key facts that an investor needs to know

when taking a first look at buying in the Philippines.

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More Filipinos eye homes in near future
The Standard-18 Mar 2016

Many Filipinos are planning to move house or apartment in the near future, and almost 80 percent of them said their main reason for doing so is to buy their first home, according to a recent survey.

Global property website Lamudi Philippines recently released a report saying that other reasons for moving house, or apartment cited by the survey’s participants include area preference (either looking for a better area, planning to move to another city, or planning to live close to relatives) (14.66 percent), work-related relocation (2.4 percent), and proximity to schools (1.44 percent).

. . .

More than half (55.05 percent) of the respondents cited Metro Manila as their preferred area for their property purchase, with Quezon City being the most preferred city (19.47 percent), followed by Makati (8.65 percent) and Manila (8.41 percent). Cebu Province is the next most cited large area after Metro Manila. Almost 7 percent of the respondents said that they are planning to buy a property in Cebu. The province is followed by Cavite at 6.73 percent.

Internet savvy

The survey also found that Filipino homebuyers are fast becoming internet savvy. Almost 80 percent of the surveyed participants cited the Internet as their starting point when researching about real estate. These survey participants cited real estate websites (such as online listings platforms), social media sites, and search engines as their usual starting point when researching about properties in the Internet.

(Yeah. It's Not surprising to find Lamudi polls favoring the internet.)

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Eton Tower (#15 on the List) : a controversial design that has not lived up to the promise of its original design


Original Render (above) is considered more appealing than the final result (below)


: Map

> SSS comment: #1

I realized this building is ugly compared to its renderings and glassy neighbour, but since its there anyway, would this be a good investment if given the opportunity?
The location is kinda irresistible and SOHOs are kinda hard to get in good locations. Of course, the unit itself has to be very very good (i.e. high floor, good orientation with views as oppose to ones facing the tall building next door, etc) for me to take a bite on.

SOHO's? : Small Office, Home Office : allow you to merge home and business in one location


Any resale?: Hi im interested to buy a resale unit here.; anyone with good offer pls inform tnx

Despite, the "ugly" design people like it enough to think about buying.

There are now almost 20 units for sale - at prices in the range of 133 - 154k psm

Video from 2010 - shows something like the original render


Will the prime location (on the DLR walkway) overcome the design concerns?

OLX Listings : 17-19 for Sale now

Eton Tower Makati a 40-storey prime property developed by Eton Properties of Lucio Tan Group of Companies. it is just a few meters from Ayala Avenue and strategically located at the heart of Makati., bounded at the corner of De La Rosa and V.A. Rufino Street., (formerly Herrera St.) in Legaspi Village., Makati City.

Eton Tower Makati is envisioned to be a Vertical Community with a mix of Executive Residences and SOHO (Small Office � Home Office) units, plus a 2-level retail mall at the ground floor that will feature shopping and dining options for residents, tenants and neighboring buildings. Indeed, it gives you a COMPLETE living package in the heart of Makati

Brimming with residential and SOHO amenities that include refreshing tower gardens every 3 floors,
The first residential condominium to be directly connected to Dela Rosa-Greenbelt elevated walkway,it raises convenience to the next level.
On top of its 2-storey dine-&-shop retail complex is an iconic design featuring vertical verdure allowing it to stand out in an already outstanding neighborhood.

Price---- / Sq.M : PerSM
P 3,100k / 22.05 = 140.6k : 21 mar. ( 5 hrs ago)
P 3,100k / 22.05 = 140.6k : 21 mar. ( 5 hrs ago)
P 3,028k / 22.00 = 137.6k : 21 mar. ( 8 hrs ago)
P 3,100k / 22.00 = 140.9k : 20 mar. ( 1 day ago)
P 3,025k / 22.00 = 137.5k : 19 mar. ( 2 days ago)
P 3,028k / 22.00 = 137.6k : 19 mar. ( 2 days ago)
P 3,025k / 22.00 = 137.5k : 18 mar. ( 3 days ago)
P 3,193k / 22.00 = 145.1k : 18 mar. ( 3 days ago)
P 3,100k / 22.00 = 140.9k : 16 mar. ( 5 days ago) : "turnover Dec. 2016"
P 3,100k / 22.00 = 140.9k : 15 mar. ( 6 days ago)
P 2,950k / 22.05 = 133.8k : 15 mar. ( 6 days ago) : 37th Fl/ t/over Aug.16?
P 3,021k / 22.66 = 133.3k : 12 mar. ( 1 week ago) : studio + balcony
P 3,100k / 22.05 = 140.6k : 09 mar. ( 1 week ago) : Desie, photos
P 7.000k / 49.52 = 141.4k : 09 mar.
P 7,700k / 50.00 = 154.0k : 09 mar.
P 3,350k / 22.00 = 152.3k : 09 mar. ( 1 week ago) : unfurnished studio
P 3,100k / 22.00 = 140.9k : 04 mar. ( 2 weeks ago) : + other units?
P 3,030k / 22.00 = 137.7k : 01 mar. ( 2 weeks ago)

fp_6623.jpg :

(in edit - added mid-April 2016):

Cheapest studio in Makati for sale. Rush.
. . .
Reselling my 23.15 sqm studio type unit in residential area at 26th floor for 2,750,000 php.
Target Turnover is 2nd quarter of 2016.
You may contact Carl at 09173099160

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  • 3 weeks later...

San Lorenzo Place - a pithy comment about the unusual Layouts of some of the units


+ San Lorenzo Pl... ( 1,646 replies - 336.0k views)

The design is actually quite awful. The living room/kitchen areas have no ventilation, apart from a small range hood above the stove that is only effective 4 hours per day because the main building exhaust fan has limited functionality so they switch it off most of the time.

The management of Empire East do not allow unit owners to install aircon in the living areas, so the place is really uncomfortable and sweaty due to the heat and humidity. And when you try to cook anything, it brings tears to your eyes.

The bedrooms are OK, because they have windows and aircon, but if you want to have comfort but don't want to spend all your time in the bedroom, you are out of luck.

I bought my unit when only the model unit was built, and it had a split aircon in the living area. I made the mistake of thinking that this meant I would be able to have the same in my unit. Very bad assumption.


> SSC : SLP thread

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The Rise




Right now, debris would need to fall Upwards to be of danger.

But that may change soon


I walked by the construction site for the Rise today...

And I was surprised to see that both the Rise and the Air seem to be at the same stage of construction. This surprised me since I think the Rise was started 6- 9 months earlier. It occurred to me to ask a woman running a food kiosk about this. Her view faces both properties, and she sees them all day long. So I asked, "Can I ask you a question? Did these properties start at the same time?" I think she thought I was asking if they were the same property. So she pointed straight ahead, and said, "SM;" and then motioned to the left, and said, "Shangrila." So she clearly knew something about her surroundings. So I asked again, "Yes. Did they start at the Same Time." She pointed again at The Rise: "Stopped."

I replied: "Okay. When stopped?" That got me a two word answer: "Two months."
Can you get more definitive than this? The sign on the site, says: General Contractor, MEC", over a large yellow sun. I made a note to investigate this company name.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Checkout these TIPS from various News articles



Real estate continues to grow its appeal

Liquid markets still preferred*
Global gateway cities (London, Paris, New York, San Francisco, Tokyo and Sydney) remain the primary target for global cross-border investors over the next 12 months. These markets have the advantage of offering large lot sizes and volume of stock that appeal to global mandates.

(in market like the Philippines, will blue-chip areas like Makati be preferred?)

Seeking value
...For some investors ‘overcrowded’ core markets are being seen for longer-term investments rather than short term trading.

Risk appetite moderated

Local partnering

Return of debt
> source: http://gio.colliers.com/


Actually, where the so-called Gateway cities are over-priced, I wonder if nearby markets (Philadelphia rather than NYC?) might be better where they offer higher yields and better fundamentals


(from the Top 10 Predictions for Philippines)


#4: Residential leasing market in Metro Manila to become more challenging

Following a pre-selling condo boom that began late in the previous decade, around 13,400 new condominium units are anticipated to be completed in the major Metro Manila CBDs in 2016, more than double the levels in 2015. On average, around 7,500 units shall be completed until 2019. This will lead to an increase in the CBD condo stock by 45% in such a short period of time.
. . .
Developers have begun looking for creative strategies in order to deal with their rising ready-for-occupancy (RFO) inventories, either through more flexible payment terms or to develop leasing models in order to create some cash flow from these unsold units. As part of the developers’ diversification strategies in the face of a softening residential sale market, we anticipate that multi-family/apartment leasing business models similar to other countries will soon emerge.
. . .
#10: Growth in retail to lead to higher warehousing and logistics demand
Despite a stock of around 7.8 million sqm of leasable area, the warehousing and logistics market in Metro Manila is very tight, operating at an average of 98% occupancy for the various warehousing districts. Warehouses in central locations in the metropolis have been dwindling as land values rise and demand for residential and commercial space increase, driving out
these low-value warehouses.
On the other hand, the retail market is expected to reach a historical high in 2016 with 725,000 sqm of new retail space coming up. This will of course increase demand for warehousing and storage space, amid the already tight market in Metro Manila.
Warehouse rentals have already exceeded P300 per sqm in key areas in the metropolis. Given the increase in demand and the worsening traffic conditions in the metro, we see rates rising in the short term in key areas.
OTHER Tips and trends for the Philippines from 2015:

Condos close to train stations more expensive

An average condo located within 100 meters of an MRT station is at least Php16,645 more expensive per square meter than a similar, newly built condo situated more than 500 meters away.


Ayala Center, Century City, Rockwell Center lead most expensive list

Ayala Center—the commercial core of the Makati CBD—commands the most expensive condo rent per sqm than any area Metro Manila. Living in the area, which is within striking distance of Greenbelt, Glorietta, and most of Makati’s luxury hotels, can set a renter back Php1,144 per sqm per month, meaning a 100-sqm condo here can command monthly rent of more than Php110,000. Following Ayala Center are Century City and Rockwell Center in Makati’s Poblacion area, where condos command monthly rents of Php986 and Php973 per sqm, respectively.


Can BPO workers afford condos?

With an average monthly salary of Php22,500, entry-level customer care representatives cannot afford to rent a condo in either of these “affordable” areas: Eastwood City, Pioneer-EDSA, Poblacion (Makati), and San Antonio (Makati), where average rents range from Php19,838 to Php22,563 per month. Using the 30 percent rule (spending not more than 30 percent of one’s monthly income on housing), only those working as managers, with an average compensation of Php75,000 per month, may only afford to rent a condo in these select areas.

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MARKET QWIRKS, and price / location mismatches


(There is a Huge potential bid under the market price for better locations)




A puzzle – why are call-centre workers under-housed

The Philippines has a thriving business process outsourcing (BPO) sector. The BPO industry is now one of the country’s biggest sources of revenues, providing employment to a large number of workers.

The country’s revenues from the BPO industry is expected to reach US$25.5 billion in 2016, according to FT Confidential Research. By that year, it is estimated that as many as 1.3 million people will be employed in the BPO sector.

BPO agents are likely to wish to rent residential spaces near their workplaces due to their night shift schedules. Since BPO agents have foreign countries as their clientele, their work hours follow suit. This means that most BPO employees work at the night time where commuting is risky while taxi cab fares are expensive.

There is a puzzle here. The income of this rising demographic overlaps with the investments made by the OFWs. Many call-centre agents are in the targeted income-bracket. But anecdotal evidence suggests that many of condominiums bought by OFWs are in the wrong place for call-centre agents.


In any case, the bottom line is that their spending-power is not yet strong enough to absorb supply. Many have family obligations and prefer to live at home or with relatives.

Maybe this will change. The Philippines will also soon experience a demographic ‘sweet spot’. The country has the third youngest population in the ASEAN region, next only to Lao PDR (median age of 21 years) and Cambodia (median age of 22 years). Based on its demographic profile, we can expect a strong demand for starter homes.


“Affordable” housing

The Philippines has a huge housing need at the low end. There are as much as 300,000 households in Metro Manila residing in informal and uninhabitable housing units which composes 8.7% of the total Metro Manila population.

These people live in appalling conditions. Many others live in very poor conditions.

To meet the needs of these families, the government embarked on the National Shelter Program to provide housing for informal settlers and other families who do not have enough income to rent nor buy houses in the prevailing markets rates.

Socialized housing units, or those which cost less than PHP 450,000 (US$ 10,800) can be purchased with a monthly amortization of PHP 2,302 (US$ 56). The Pag-Ibig Fund, (which is the Filipino word for love), the country’s state-owned and subsidized housing loan provider, provides a fixed rate of 4.5% for 30 years for socialized housing units.

The problem is that these low-end housing units are usually far from work.


> http://www.globalpropertyguide.com/Asia/Philippines/Price-History

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The Air, and The Rise... are going up here - in front of Alpha Tower


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  • 3 weeks later...

Jazzing it up... To justify the price?




> SSC-TheGentry: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1907685&page=4


Official Launch announced on June 8th in Business World:

Alveo launches project in Salcedo Village (pg.2)

+ A Mix-use, multi-tower development, due to be completed in 2021-22
+ Location: 4,227 sm of Land along Valero St., expected to generate P 5 bn. in sales
+ 43-storey residential building with 391 units on the upper 36 floors
+ Three-levels of retail (with 30 shops), and four levels of parking
+ The office component will start development next year, and is expected to be sold

This is the 15th tower from Alveo, which has launched residential, office, and mixed use
towers across Makati


ALVEO's new The Gentry Residences, will share its space with office condominiums, and a mall.
Interesting to see that the new (and more highly-priced) offerings are being jazzed up with Mixed use and shopping to make them standout from a pure Residential space

(Here's another, just announced):
Megaworld Corporation offers you our latest project at the prime location of Makati City​ -​

The Ellis: A 30-storey tower with guaranteed high quality project​.​
It also offers exclusivity like no other with only 11 units per floor for a total of only 237 units.
The Ellis will be our most sophisticated project to date offering creative amenities such as :
the Pause​ &Play Room, Co- Lab ​(Shared Workspace​) and Town Hall (Function Room).
LOCATION: Front St: ​L.P. Leviste St. / Back St: ​San Agustin​ St.

= unquote =

Presumably, the shared workspace is to make them attractive to people who will work from home, and not want to pay the rising office rents.
Will we see new types of Working arrangements arise, to work within this space?


I believe the Gentry is priced at something like P 165-175 k psm,

and the postings on SSC show an even higher price for the Ellis:

"Introductory Average Price: Php 175k/SQM for the first 25 units sold"


Megaworld likes to connect Time Pressure with its pricing - yet this building completes after 2020, I believe.


Colliers has just reported a DROP in Average Rents in Makati and BGC (- 1.57% to P 869 per sm, in Q1),

and has said they expect prices to drop further. But the developers go on pushing their prices higher,

and stand by their argument that if you don't buy now, prices will push higher.


( Reaction / from meamoantonio, on SSC):

Presumably, the shared workspace is to make them attractive to people who will work from home, and not want to pay the rising office rents.
Will we see new types of Working arrangements arise, to work within this space?

actually there are already existing types of working arrangements that capitalize on these "shared work spaces" or day rate offices, ive been seeing alot of office spaces that have per day rates that cater to freelancers, per project employees and virtual employees etc etc. Ive seen other developers like Shang also come up with amenities similar to this, maybe the "Millenial" generation is really sick of being stuck in an office for years and developers and business owners have already realized this and are capitalizing on it early on

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(I was asked about FIBR connections by email):

"I have decided that I must upgrade my internet capability.

The best way seems to be to get a PLDT FIBR connection which is avallable in
these locations."
>LINK, see locations*: http://pldthome.com/fibr/areas


"So I am bottom fishing for the lowest possible rental in one of these areas.

You know much more about the apartment/condo market than I ever
will so I wonder if you might have a suggestion for me."

(I will ask on Saturday, whether this inspires any ideas)


Makati City
Bel-Air Village1-4, Dasmariñas, Forbes Park, Kasiyahan, Magallanes,
Palm, San Lorenzo, San Miguel, Urdaneta Village
Gramercy Residence / Knightsbridge Residences
Joya Loft
Manila Polo Club Townhouses
One Roxas Triangle
Pacific Plaza Condominium
Pacific Plaza Towers
Paseo de Magallanes
Urdaneta Apartment

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The Rise : Agents are now congratulating their clients for investing, after the latest price rise there:


Good Day Maam/Sir,
I would like to inform you that your unit at The Rise Makati by Shangri-la Properties has another price increased of 8%.
Congrats on your investment. Minimum value for The Rise Makati now is 4.3M.
There has been another price increase at The Rise, of 8%
Your unit's value should benefit.
Of course, the profit only becomes real when you sell.
And Shang will have to build it. I will drop by soon, and see if the works have started again
The Price of Parking Spaces seems to be jumping as well:
wow parking seems really expensive. Ranging from 1.2M++ to amost 1.5M.
Lerato is still sub 1M. Any thoughts on this?
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  • 10 months later...

And another video from an American expat called Kevin Sanders


I believe he's against the idea of "hedging" your wealth by buying properties in PH,

yet "hedging" is a strategy that is employed by a lot of foreign investors IMO.

I have read several posts on SSC and the main purpose of buying PH properies

-- for some posters -- is just the "hedge".


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IS MAKATI Too Expensive now?


Kevin gives some good advice, but it is not right for everyone.

For instance, he recommends "not buying in Metro Manila". He thinks it is too expensive.

"If you are buying there to be close to your girl friend, she may not mind traveling an hour or so outside Manila, where prices are cheaper"

Actually, I disagree with this.

It is easy to have commutes of one hour or more INSIDE Manila, and some of those commutes can be pretty horrific.

Personally, I want easy access to the airport, and a more cosmopolitan life. I also want a property which is easy to rent and is salable.

These factors point me to Manila, and more specifically to Makati, BGC, Rockwell, or Ortigas.

The main problem is the present oversupply, which may make it harder to rent, and harder to sell.

But the over-supply will not last for ever. I expect it to easy within 2-3 years. But I think it is a good idea to avoid buying over-priced properties now

Cost of living : "you can sit in the middle quite comfortably"

Cheap property and cost of living in the Philippines

"We were living on 5,000 pesos per month... back in 2007"

That's incredibly tight - unless you have nothing to pay for rent, or are sleeping on a beach in the provinces.

As it is, the association fee on my small studio flat is about P 2,000 /month, and that will increase if/when I move into a larger flat next year.

Personally, I spend a lot on coffee shops every week - so that I can get faster web connections

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Matt Wilkie, Live on youtube

A few questions were asked during that live event. Apparantly he's got a service

station and around 6 apartments/flat in that same building in the Cebu area I believe.

He does not recommend buying a 3,5Million flat and getting 20K rental income

as the income is not guaranteed. He says be careful of agents...

That's what others have told here as well

He says he's doing fairly well with income in PH, Spain and UK.

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  • 2 weeks later...

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