tinecu Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Gold Maples are a very nice coin, as are the Philarkmonikers. You should probably expect delivery on Thursday via UPS. I like the 1kg 'coins' ...saves hours of counting The Times says 'Hoard Gold' today!! The masses are wising up at last. Return to the 1970s: how to reap a profit in the downturn With the rocketing price of oil, gold and many other commodities reminding investors of the turmoil that Britain faced 35 years ago, we asked the professionals to outline the best ways to profit from the current chaos raging in the world’s markets http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/busi...icle3558728.ece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marceau Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 I just posted this over at ADVFN in response to someone arguing against Fed intervention. Now I'm all for letting things go pop and agree completely that by inflating we are merely prolonging the inevitable. But it is worth baring in mind what is at stake here and realising what a knife edge our way of life could be on. They are panicking precisely because we are beyond the point of simple recession. If they let it unwind fully we are talking about a depression, the sort of thing which prompts revolution and war. The 'paper' trillion figures will be converted in real losses just as sure as they were used to generate real profits. Do not make the mistake of thinking this is the endgame of the last few years of the housing bubble. If handled incorrectly this will be the endgame of the last half-decade of credit expansion. The scale is unimaginable, as will be the deleveraging. Take a look at Brazil, credit barely exists there, everything that is bought has to be paid for in full, 100%. Transpose that situation to the western economies and imagine the carnage. My point about transposing Brazil's credit market into our own economies I think brings home the scale of the problem. Everything must be paid for outright in Brazil: cars, houses, small businesses. What loans do exist carry interest rates you would not believe. This rule only applies to the locals of course, the corporate monkeys play by a different set of rules and always will, but imagine having the 'locals' in the UK, US etc constrained in the same way. THAT is what we face if this all collapses. I sometimes forget the underlying reason I'm playing the gold game and occasionally something will give me a stark reminder. There is no way the Central Banks will capitulate to deleveraging and deflation, even though they may well know they will lose in the end. When they do finally lose, gold will suffer. Maybe not as much as everything else, but it will suffer. We all need to be ready to adapt when circumstances change, holding on to an idea when it has become incorrect will lead us down the same path as those who cling to the UK housing market today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 This is quite some article.If you read it right through you might get to feel the true enormity of what is happening at the moment. It's not every day people talk seriously about "world financial collapse". Central Banks $2.5 Trillion Money Supply Fails to Stop Global Deleveraging http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article4016.html Very interesting article. I think I agree with this. The only question is whether the central banks will really give up, or whether they just let hyperinflation run its way. In any case, you better got some gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marceau Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Very interesting article. I think I agree with this. The only question is whether the central banks will really give up, or whether they just let hyperinflation run its way. In any case, you better got some gold. Chris Laird is a good commentator with his eye very much on the macroeconomic picture. He has made some very good predictions over the years. You'll like this one goldfinger, one of his predictions was for gold at $30,000 an ounce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 ...Take a look at Brazil, credit barely exists there, everything that is bought has to be paid for in full, 100%. Transpose that situation to the western economies and imagine the carnage. ... This thought is putright scary. The average UK home would plunge to levels even we can't imagine right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Chris Laird is a good commentator with his eye very much on the macroeconomic picture. He has made some very good predictions over the years. You'll like this one goldfinger, one of his predictions was for gold at $30,000 an ounce. Think about it. If all this deleveraging is mopped up by the central banks, $30,000 wouldn't really look like that big of a deal. Everyone and their dog would dump their paper cr@p on the central banks, take the money, and put it into hard assets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Very interesting that the leading German news magazin DER SPIEGEL runs a story on 'dirty gold' just now that gold threatens to breach $1,000. It's alway possible to write an article on 'dirty XXX' -- XXX being any commodity of your choice. http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wren Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Moderation policy over at hpc seems a bit quirky. Early today I made a few comments on various threads (including gold comments) which got through moderation (I'm back on moderation after linking here). This one has not got through (yet at least). The wording was slightly better in the original which I didn't keep a copy of. If a bubble in the price of gold occurs at some later stage (personally I hope it won't), the reason will be rather fear than greed. The gold market is peculiar and unlike houses or shares. A rough housing mania analogy might be a wannabe FTBer thinking “I’ve got to buy now or I’ll never get on the ladder”. Investors after taking severe losses would be thinking “How the hell can I preserve my capital?” and turn to gold as a flight to safety. Let's hope it doesn't get that bad. It was in the "Gold bug, not gold thug" thread which DrBubb also posted on. Seemed a pretty innocuous post to me. Is it too close to the bone maybe? I'd be interested to hear whether you agree or disagree with that post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...&refer=home Paulson Says He'll `Do What It Takes' to Calm Markets (Update4) By Brendan Murray March 16 (Bloomberg) -- Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson, defending the bailout of Bear Stearns Cos., said policy makers will do whatever is needed to prevent disruptions in financial markets from hurting the economy. ``The government is prepared to do what it takes to maintain the stability of our financial system,'' Paulson told the ``Fox News Sunday'' television program in Washington today. ``Our focus, our No. 1 priority, is the stability of our financial system.'' This means there is going to be A LOT OF MONEY PRINTED. Paulson said that in the case of Bear Stearns, the risk to financial stability outweighed his concern about so- called moral hazard, in which investors come to expect government rescues. ``I'm as aware as anyone is of moral hazard,'' he said in a CNN interview. ``I'm also aware of the importance of keeping our economy strong, of orderly capital markets, of the stability of the financial system doing things that promote orderliness and minimize the disruption.'' No more questions. BUY GOLD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pluto Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Anyone notice a shift in Puplava in the recent months? A year or so ago he was advising folk to buy physical and even store it in Canada - now he seems to be pimping the ETFs. On the Q calls he again recommended them. Weird change in stance, or is it just me being paranoid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConvertedGoldBug Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Anyone notice a shift in Puplava in the recent months? A year or so ago he was advising folk to buy physical and even store it in Canada - now he seems to be pimping the ETFs. On the Q calls he again recommended them. Weird change in stance, or is it just me being paranoid? Maybe trying to promote an alternative to buying physical coins? Could help push the price up by using the simple option of ETFs for those with stockbroker accounts, who might not consider actually buying physical gold... You know... everyone's saying "Buy Gold!!!", but not everyone might know how to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pluto Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Maybe trying to promote an alternative to buying physical coins? Could help push the price up by using the simple option of ETFs for those with stockbroker accounts, who might not consider actually buying physical gold... You know... everyone's saying "Buy Gold!!!", but not everyone might know how to do that. No, that's not it. His mantra was to buy physical bullion or stocks - preferably jnrs. He used to talk about confiscation and currency controls as well. He hasn't mentioned either for a while now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 No, that's not it. His mantra was to buy physical bullion or stocks - preferably jnrs. He used to talk about confiscation and currency controls as well. He hasn't mentioned either for a while now. Over the last year or so he never really mentioned confiscation or issues with ETFs, although he quite often has James Turk on the show. I think he just thinks it's not really going to be an issue. He seems much more concerned about naked Juniors short-selling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pluto Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 The brainwashed are being parted from their only possessions that are retaining any value. Please view the video and watch the sharks at work. http://www.wsoctv.com/news/15314109/detail.html “We encourage them not to leave anything at home, bring everything in, let us look at it,” he said. “The average person that comes in, they go out with a check of average of $500 to $1,500.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmaupoil Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 You'll like this one goldfinger, one of his predictions was for gold at $30,000 an ounce. Yes but with hyperinflation predictions, if I can only still buy one nice suit with $30000 an ounce then I will be able to say that I have not lost any money which is not bad I suppose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wren Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Does anybody know to what extent gold (and silver) ETFs are bought on margin? Do you think many retail gold and silver investors borrow to buy bullion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 The brainwashed are being parted from their only possessions that are retaining any value. Please view the video and watch the sharks at work.... Perry said he thinks gold prices will continue to rise over the next few months and years, but it's not just gold – silver is also in big demand. And, on Friday, platinum hit an all-time high. The average punter will wake up to this too at some stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marmite Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Yes, in the European Union gold bullion is free of VAT, due to an EU law of Jan 1 2000. Gold bars and standard bullion coins certainly count as bullion. (Collectors' coins may not be depending on the price. I forget the details of the definition, something like if the price is no more than 50% more than the spot price of the gold content it counts as bullion.) In the EU silver is not in general free of VAT. I posted this before. Does anyone have any thoughts as I cant find anything on the web as to why the VAT was abolished ????? One thing that has been bugging me about Gold. If gold is anti banks / wall street and not in the goverments interest. Why does the goverment not just slap 17.5% VAT on it like silver ????? This would make private ownership a lot more expensive. Why was VAT abolished on investment gold as of January 1st 2000 ???? This ties up with " The Brown Bottom " : The sale of 400 tons of bullion in a series of auctions between 1999 and 2002 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Thyme Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 I guess this kinda got lost in Friday's $1000 euphoria so apologies for re-posting . . . Dr B, do you believe that the central banks will intervene to prop up the dollar ? If so, wouldn't that be similar to what the BoE did with the pound before we were tossed out of the ERM ? The point I'm getting at is would one just short the dollar in order to make a nice profit out of it or would the combined purchasing power of the Fed, the ECB, BoE and BoJ be too much for the market to go toe-to-toe with ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G0ldfinger Posted March 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 I posted this before. Does anyone have any thoughts as I cant find anything on the web as to why the VAT was abolished ?????... My guess would be that gold was finally perceived as destroyed and no danger anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azazel Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 I posted this before. Does anyone have any thoughts as I cant find anything on the web as to why the VAT was abolished ????? One thing that has been bugging me about Gold. If gold is anti banks / wall street and not in the goverments interest. Why does the goverment not just slap 17.5% VAT on it like silver ????? This would make private ownership a lot more expensive. Why was VAT abolished on investment gold as of January 1st 2000 ???? This ties up with " The Brown Bottom " : The sale of 400 tons of bullion in a series of auctions between 1999 and 2002 I think it was because gold is money and you cant charge VAT on money. Also it was an EU ruling to harmonize Europe on the matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wren Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Why was VAT abolished on investment gold as of January 1st 2000 ???? Maybe you saw my earlier answer. Such a change of law could only make gold a better investment vehicle. I know of no other physical product with such an EU law. I can think of no reason other than that the rich elites were paving the way for their further enrichment (I'm a cynic but I'd rather be an epicurian). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikk03 Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 I think it was because gold is money and you cant charge VAT on money. Also it was an EU ruling to harmonize Europe on the matter. Ive not bought alot of gold in bullion bars. Do you pay the VAT when you buy it or sell it? Also ....... If I went to EU on holiday and purchased a brick ...... as long as it was worth less than 10k (I know u have to declare valuables worth more than 10k in money- does gold count?) could I avoid VAT? If I was stopped and searched at the airport would i be done for tax avoidance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marmite Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 I can think of no reason other than that the rich elites were paving the way for their further enrichment (I'm a cynic but I'd rather be an epicurian). This is what I would like to think ..................... Or do they want the people to buy up the gold for some reason ???? I have no idea But this one question has really been bugging me. Why overinflate the currency and then make gold an even more attractive investment by abolishing the VAT. Surely the " rich elite " could accumulate the gold anyway. When this EU law was passed didnt the bankers think " hold on a second " ???? Or did the bankers want the law pushed through ?????? Its certainly a question that needs some thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wren Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Ive not bought alot of gold in bullion bars. Do you pay the VAT when you buy it or sell it? Also ....... If I went to EU on holiday and purchased a brick ...... as long as it was worth less than 10k (I know u have to declare valuables worth more than 10k in money- does gold count?) could I avoid VAT? If I was stopped and searched at the airport would i be done for tax avoidance? It's a European Union law, so it applies in the UK also. No VAT on gold bullion by law. I don't know what happens if you carry a lot of gold across a border. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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