grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Answer: Basic insecurity. They dont want cherished beliefs to be questioned as opposed to cherished charts'n'graphs how you dealing with Climategate ? ooopps hee ... hee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Actually I'm in Copenhagen for a few days, coincidentally just down the road from the Global Warming Rally. Ironically the weather is bitterly cold and snow has come earlier than usual. A nice joke from Mother Nature? If I can get there I'll report back on the shivering crowds. ah, the irony....... btw, it's the climate change doctrine now...remember change insinuates colder or warmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drbubb Posted December 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Good post enrieb and bang on Amazing how this place instantly changed as soon as 24k was set up? The problem always was swampy. In many ways a take my hat off to him on his ability to manipulate a large group of people into doing his dirty work. Its just a shame that this group of people do not have the ability to step back and see when they are being manipulated It seems that some "who know who he really is", are somehow in awe of him. Yet not knowing his identity, all I see is a mostly troublesome guy, who occasionally posts some useful material. Cgnao is another self-appointed mysterian, but without the issue of being abrasive. It will be interesting to see if he turns up as a regular on the other site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drbubb Posted December 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 oh, forgot to ask, how does one become a 'loyal GEIer' ?? when do the special clubs start ? I want a life with differing opinion, that's how I learn. I don't think swampy or myself are 'trolls' I have never been called a troll......h'mmm I almost thought you would quote Groucho Marx: "I dont want to join a club that would have me as a member." / Haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drbubb Posted December 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Spot on Bubb. I much appreciate GEI and personally just ignore those who seem to have an inflexible take on events or an over-confident idea of their ability to predict the future. Maybe the best policy is just to keep quiet and let folks who want to big up their group-think get on with it on their own. After all if a dissenting voices is savaged, why bother to raise it. Like economic policy often the best thing is masterly inactivity. Sorry if this point has been made already. I'm catching up and don't have time to read the whole thread at the moment. (So this post might be ill-timed for some, in which case I'll adopt my approach of slective listening). Actually I'm in Copenhagen for a few days, coincidentally just down the road from the Global Warming Rally. Ironically the weather is bitterly cold and snow has come earlier than usual. A nice joke from Mother Nature? If I can get there I'll report back on the shivering but surprised crowds. Thanks for the post. I wonder if being in Copenhagen gives you any special insights on the circus going on there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 It seems that some "who know who he really is", are somehow in awe of him. Yet not knowing his identity, all I see is a mostly troublesome guy, who occasionally posts some useful material. I stuck by him before I knew who he was/is. Cgnao is another self-appointed mysterian, but without the issue of being abrasive. It will be interesting to see if he turns up as a regular on the other site nope, you chased him remember. Now he gives only very short warning because imo he wants the gold doubters & fiat shouters™ to lose the lot for their ignorance & arrogance. All imho of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 btw Bubb, is your userbase back up, because iirc you started to panic & almost begged GF to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbear Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 ah, the irony....... btw, it's the climate change doctrine now...remember change insinuates colder or warmer You're right of course. Just part of the linguistic fancy footsteps necessary when the world didn't go to expectations. So highly relevant to this thread after all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No6 Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Its precisely the right word to use, you're trolling this thread right now. Thats not a label and its not ad hominen its fair comment. The majority of your posts in this thread are adding no content to a thread that is supposed to be about the 'long term direction of the site' and gauging opinion from 'the loyal posters', not the ones that ran off to join a new forum. Your just trying to resurrect the same old arguments about control, an amateur form of reverse psychology to shut down and limit a debate about taking action on unacceptable posting behaviour. You posted a picture of someone with egg on their face and linked it vaguely with DrBubb and No6 when in reality it is you who have the egg on your face after messaging all the 'true believers' and encouraging them to quit GEI and join a 24k. Inadvertently you have done us all a favour and shown us what the site is like without the trolls. You talk about 'trust' yet you have betrayed any trust shown in you by your actions to undermine GEI and now towards Pixil8r with your vague insults towards his moderation. 24k can be a good site in addition to GEI and be a home for posters who are uber bullish on gold, theres no need for both sites to become opposed and create bad feeling. I can see what Pixil8r is trying to achieve as I think he wanted a site that was more geared towards precious metals and less on trading. This site is a mix and was never intended to be, as far as I'm aware, a gold or purely metals forum. The investing part of it was wider for this site, although people passionate about gold and metals are welcome here. After all, a home was found here for many when things went nuclear over at HPC. However, for those setting up a pure metals forum there is a lot of direct competition like Gold Is Money. They also have rules. Here they are. 1. No Porno. 2. No Ads. 3. No personal attacks or threats to other GIM members. You break any of the above and you may get banned from the GIM site! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerpy Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 I don't think swampy or myself are 'trolls' I have never been called a troll......h'mmm GOM really? Just for you In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet) Nope can't possibly be called a Troll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enrieb Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Amazing how this place instantly changed as soon as 24k was set up? The problem always was swampy. In many ways a take my hat off to him on his ability to manipulate a large group of people into doing his dirty work. Its just a shame that this group of people do not have the ability to step back and see when they are being manipulated Swampy was simply a demagogue, but demagogues are popular and will always gain followers. The simple posting rights that we all have were abused and stretched to the limit. we all have the right to post pictures - but some abuse this right we all have the right to show +1 -1 in support of posts we like or dislike - but some abuse this right we all have the right to make jokes - but some abuse this right we all have the right to go slightly off topic in a thread - but some abuse this right we all have the right to question the running of the site - but some abuse this right we all have the right to use caps lock - BUT SOME ABUSE THIS RIGHT etc.. The abuse of simple posting rights seriously lowered the standards regarding what sort of behaviour was acceptable at GEI. This attracted other like minded individuals and made some other good long term posters feel that this type of interaction was acceptable. Attempts to stop the abuse resulted in the tired and predictable free speech fallacy. People talk about free speech, but free speech to what? free speech to shout down and ridicule anyone who does not agree with them, free speech to be abusive towards other posters free speech to make false claims about what other posters have wrote free speech to apply to others standards that they do not apply to themselves free speech to use abusive language The free speech fallacy was an attempt to shut down and limit the debate about standards. A discussion board is about discussing things, not simply forcing your opinions on to others. You can see a definite trend in the way some posters tried to shut down debate by ridicule, flattery, abuse, spamming. Going back to the posting of pictures as a form of replying to posts, it can be helpful to post a picture IF it adds content or a video that is relevant, but when all that is being posted is just a picture its the equivalent of pulling faces and making hand gestures. The question to ask is what is being communicated by the use of that image? This tactic was used to the point of spamming abuse, and was lauded as witty and a sign of great intelligence, but when others posted images in retaliation it was not taken as wit. Hypocrisy is applying to others standards that you do not apply to yourself. Spamming a thread with images also has the effect of upping the general noise level and burying relevant on topic posts, possibly a deliberate tactic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 You're right of course. Just part of the linguistic fancy footsteps necessary when the world didn't go to expectations. So highly relevant to this thread after all! don't worry, I tend to post in elliot waves.......I'm in a major C wave atm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Swampy was simply a demagogue, but demagogues are popular and will always gain followers. The simple posting rights that we all have were abused and stretched to the limit. we all have the right to post pictures - but some abuse this right we all have the right to show +1 -1 in support of posts we like or dislike - but some abuse this right we all have the right to make jokes - but some abuse this right we all have the right to go slightly off topic in a thread - but some abuse this right we all have the right to question the running of the site - but some abuse this right etc.. The abuse of simple posting rights seriously lowered the standards regarding what sort of behaviour was acceptable at GEI. This attracted other like minded individuals and made some other good long term posters feel that this type of interaction was acceptable. Attempts to stop the abuse resulted in the tired and predictable free speech fallacy. People talk about free speech, but free speech to what? free speech to shout down and ridicule anyone who does not agree with them, free speech to be abusive towards other posters free speech to make false claims about what other posters have wrote free speech to apply to others standards that they do not apply to themselves free speech to use abusive language The free speech fallacy was an attempt to shut down and limit the debate about standards. A discussion board is about discussing things, not simply forcing your opinions on to others. You can see a definite trend in the way some posters tried to shut down debate by ridicule, flattery, abuse, spamming. Going back to the posting of pictures as a form of replying to posts, it can be helpful to post a picture IF it adds content or a video that is relevant, but when all that is being posted is just a picture its the equivalent of pulling faces and making hand gestures. The question to ask is what is being communicated by the use of that image? This tactic was used to the point of spamming abuse, and was lauded as witty and a sign of great intelligence, but when others posted images in response it was not taken as wit. Hypocrisy is applying to others standards that you do not apply to yourself. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 GOM really? Just for you In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet) Nope can't possibly be called a Troll I bet I put a smirk on yer face though sometimes rigger....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drbubb Posted December 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Swampy : I stuck by him before I knew who he was/is. Haha. That's one way to put it Cgnao : nope, you chased him remember. Now he gives only very short warning because imo he wants the gold doubters & fiat shouters™ to lose the lot for their ignorance & arrogance. All imho of course. Hardly "chased him." At worst, you could say I (mostly) ignored him. btw Bubb, is your userbase back up, because iirc you started to panic & almost begged GF to stay. Hardly. But I value GF's contribution, especially his charts (and consistency) GOOD POINTS, Newbear. Some unpleasant posts go beyond civility, and abuse the flexible rules here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Haha. That's one way to put it it's the truth, I never lie.....remember. swampy & I know & that's what counts to me. Hardly "chased him." At worst, you could say I (mostly) ignored him. really...... nope, imo you really p1ssed him off. You could have been so far ahead of the game with cgnao on side, but you chose the paper route & hence spun the double headed coin in the air whilst shouting tails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romans holiday Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 I almost thought you would quote Groucho Marx: "I dont want to join a club that would have me as a member." / Haha Woody Allen I believe. I like this one from Groucho, "If you don't like my principles, I have others." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littledavesab Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 It seems to me a lot of effort has been put in by both sides of the argument over something I see as a storm in a tea cup c'est la vie I would add that it seems to me that GOM has always had a friendlier side to the argument - maybe I think he kept his sense of humor while all around were loosing theirs! + Why did it ever become an argument this is a discussion site after all. Ps. I try and be open minded but even I have the odd blip! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerpy Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 I bet I put a smirk on yer face though sometimes rigger....... From: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 It seems to me a lot of effort has been put in by both sides of the argument over something I see as a storm in a tea cup c'est la vie I would add that it seems to me that GOM has always had a friendlier side to the argument - maybe I think he kept his sense of humor while all around were loosing theirs! + Why did it ever become an argument this is a discussion site after all. Ps. I try and be open minded but even I have the odd blip! indeed. listen, I have to go pick my daughter up from Uni now for xmas, so if anyone is in need of any home truths, issues resolved quickly or general good humoured banter & quick wit, then you will have to make do with <insert GOM equivalent user here> Perhaps enrieb could organise a poll in my absence to fill in the replacement ? ps - my management meetings were never very long but we got sh1tloads resolved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wren Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 ah, the irony....... btw, it's the climate change doctrine now...remember change insinuates colder or warmer Change you can believe in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Mustard Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 It's a peculiar phenomenon, this move from advocacy to religious zealotry - it occurs in the AGW debate, too. Some people just seem to be incapable of supporting a particular position without becoming involved in a religious/faith type way to the point that there is no debate possible - they simply close their ears to any alternative view and, worse still, become very angry when an alternative view is proposed. Strange.....at least, it is to me. I relish opposing and differing views - it is only through considering extremes and differences of opinion that I find I am able to work out a position for myself. I found the AGW debates very disturbing as I was in such a small minority defending a position that most people here think is utterly insane. It was a most bizarre experience to deal with the strength of feeling and incredible conviction of various posters on a subject that in no way can be said to be settled one way or the other. I think some of the sceptics in particular have been, in effect, trolling for their views without being prepared to accept they might be wrong or to provide proper arguments as to why the sceptical scientists are definitely more likely to be correct than the 'consenus' climate scientists. I am going avoid the AGW debates as they are just way too creepy. People say things on forums they just wouldn't DARE to say to someone's face. And if they would dare to say these things to someone's face they are most probably sociopaths. They do not even know who the other person is, in most cases, and would probably be shocked in some cases if they found out. Forums seem to attract people who feel they have all the answers and who think they have special insights into the workings of the world government, the illuminati and so on. In some cases they have valid insights and information. But they need to see themselves, almost at all costs, to be above the "sheeple". Having read with astonishment some of the posts on this site and on HPC I can only conclude that many posters exhibit most of the symptoms of Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Anyone who contradicts their views is ridiculed. The very behaviour of which they accuse their enemies is indulged in to epic proportions. The ones who know the most shout the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No6 Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 it's the truth, I never lie.....remember. swampy & I know & that's what counts to me. GOM, I would never call you a liar, but I assume you didn't mean it when you said that you would never post on here again? At the time I was sorry to see you go. There is always a start & an end to everything, how we deal with the early parts of an issue are very, very important. This applies to every area of life, both work & personal. I have quite often been taken on for my interpersonal & general communication skills in dealing with situations that are either out of hand or perhaps will get out of hand. the early posts were crucial imo, but also show other posters motives imo. Looking at how things have been dealt with, escalated & the various options offered by various posters on this forum, is it any wonder TPTB make decisions that we think are unbelievably stupid ? how many people on here themselves used bad or innapropriate language, made blind decisions or followed a common thought for STS (serve to self) ? has anyone looked back & thought they made a mistake on a post/thread ? I have definetly made a few mistakes. Obviously Mr Phillips also made some mistakes in terminology used & content/type of posts etc........when he is much more capable of so much more. Sometime though we probably realise that where the general consensus is 99% against the majority of our thoughts then there will only ever be one outcome. I have always said that I generally do not get on with people who work in IT, Finance or Finance related areas. I also do not normally get on with managers who are bent on bean counting as their main objective. This will never change because it is one of my most important morals, people must come before monetary gain. Health & family, that's what it's always about, tinged with a certain amount of money to enjoy a reasonable lifestyle. My time on these virtual forums was also always limited. Cdswamp & I discussed many months ago about not posting again because we need to move in a different direction (especially me obviously). I thank you all for your time & help & wish none of you any harm (even nicejim although I hope he & others have learnt something about themselves after this), but please re-evaluate your lives & outlook some of you, it really is not all about the money. fwiw, aliveandkicking.....I genuinly thought/think that you are actually an ok person & in real life we probably have a lot in common. Everything I have ever said on any internet forum has always been the truth, I have never lied. ps - I will still watch from time to time because some of the posters & information is invaluable, but will never again post under GOM or GOMr on here or hpc. My virtual time as this poster has come to an end now. Good Luck All & Thank you. Nick (aka GOM) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HPCsoYESTERDAY Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 it's the truth, I never lie.....remember. swampy & I know & that's what counts to me. GOM - genuinely help me out here i am confused as to whether swampy was telling fibs or not; 1 - pix stated from the start that swampy had informed him he didn't want to have anything more to do with 24k because of pix removing an offensive post re., dr. b & S. Net. 2 - swampy said this was not the case and he found himself reading his own obituary thread etc. 3 - pix. posts an email where swampy clearly states he doesn't want anything more to do with the site etc (because of the reason stated in point 1) i am genuinely asking you is someone telling fibs here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drbubb Posted December 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 it's the truth, I never lie.....remember. swampy & I know & that's what counts to me. really...... nope, imo you really p1ssed him off. You could have been so far ahead of the game with cgnao on side, but you chose the paper route & hence spun the double headed coin in the air whilst shouting tails. Why not back that up. Cgnao almost never engaged in actual discussions, he always hid behind loads of "Guru attitude" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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