GOLD

[qwerty]

Who, exactly, are the "cartel"?

 

How, exactly, do "they" influence the global price of gold?

 

For, exactly, what purpose?

 

 

Its a Cartel Secret! but they can cause unflatable unflation in unflated assets!

 

 

Here is a nice chart courtesy of the wonderfull Jesse's cafe of the dollar.

 

http://jessescrossroadscafe.blogspot.com/

 

 

 

[Steve Netwriter]

Steve,

Thanks for asking the question. It lead to me re-finding this great listen.

 

Manipulation in the market, An amazing interview - a MUST listen !!!!!

http://www.greenenergyinvestors.com/index.php?showtopic=3454

 

Which mentions this podcast:

 

http://netcastdaily.com/broadcast/fsn2008-0621-3b.mp3

 

A must listen (even again), specially now !!!!!

 

[Compounded]

:lol: :lol:

 

I think that deserves a little more prominence

 

 

:lol:

 

Fundamentals will out

 

Fundamentals will out

 

Fundamentals will out.

 

I am guessing gold is a bit odd, very very volatile, but christ look at a chart of the 70's gold price.

 

FFS you lot gold has 25% corrections in bull markets regularly, all you have to do is be sure you understand the fundamentals.

 

Forget gold, to decide the fundamental of gold all you need to know - is the dollar crap?

 

Had a few beers so will post anyway.

 

 

 

 

 

[G0ldfinger]

I have never seen this hapen at Kitco before on their front page and I have been visiting that site for around four years!.

 

 

http://www.kitco.com/

I read about it before. Everyone on GIM is crying their eyes out because no one is selling silver anymore.

[Steve Netwriter]

I have never seen this hapen at Kitco before on their front page and I have been visiting that site for around four years!.

 

 

http://www.kitco.com/

 

I've got to document that one

 

 

[Steve Netwriter]

Had a few beers so will post anyway.

 

:lol:

 

[Compounded]

Guess it's not late Fri night in NZ

 

I am right certain of it the only real worry us gold investers have is that USD turns out to be OK.

[njpurser]

I read about it before. Everyone on GIM is crying their eyes out because no one is selling silver anymore.

 

Erm, isn't this the time for pictures of rockets?

 

This screams massive spike imminent.

 

The fundamentals of the dollar backed monetary system are still sh&t and getting worse, the fed stop selling gold and silver, and dealers can't fill orders, and we are all looking for the bottom on TA????

 

The PPT have tricked you.

 

I got my 5k in at 950 in March, the week before BS went pop- at BV (Zurich) and I'm sticking.

And I'm looking forward to the Option/ARM debacle to start unfolding at reset time , then prime, then back to subprime resets etc. and so on and so forth....

 

Outsiders will not prop up the US forever, though they may make a dignified exit.

I cannot see any way of avoiding meltdown, it is already written in. Why bottle it now?

 

Nick

 

[qwerty]

GF you were asking some question on GIM about currencies and the Jim Sinclair ratio etc again from Jesse's this article from the FT thought you might find it interesting

 

http://jessescrossroadscafe.blogspot.com/s...p;max-results=7

 

The Decline of G7 Bretton Woods II and Monetary Colonialism

 

At some point the Rest of the World may realize that having any nation's fiat money as the international reserve currency is nothing more a thinly veiled form of colonialism.

 

 

Policy is a matter for The World, not just a Rich Club

By Jean Pisani-Ferry

The Financial Times

August 12 2008 19:40

 

As the collapse of the trade talks in Geneva in July made clear, there is no longer any   meaningful  trade negotiation without the main nations from the emerging world. The year 2008 may go down in history as the one in which rich countries discovered that this applies to macroeconomic policies, too.

 

In January it looked as if the opposite lessons could be drawn from events. For a while, Ben Bernanke at the US Federal Reserve and Jean-Claude Trichet at the European Central Bank seemed to be the only relevant policymakers in the world – and they were, as far as liquidity strains were concerned, if only because the US and Europe account for about two-thirds of the global supply of financial assets.

 

But as months went by, it became clear that countries affected by the shock represented merely a half of world gross domestic product, two-fifths of global energy demand and not even a third of world cereal consumption. Furthermore, rich countries have significantly less weight at the margin: their contribution to world growth is about half their share of world GDP, so one-quarter of the total, and the same rule of thumb applies even more to the demand for oil and foodstuffs. So in the market for scarce commodities, the effects of the slowdown in the US and Europe were offset by domestic booms in the emerging world.

 

By the end of spring, policymakers in the Group of Seven leading nations had awoken to an uncomfortable reality that focusing on a regional financial shock had led them to ignore a global commodity shock. Worse, thanks to the fact that most emerging and developing countries in Asia and the Gulf were part of a de facto dollar zone, actions taken by the Fed to address financial stress in fact compounded runaway domestic demand in those countries and fuelled global hunger for commodities. In spite of rising inflation, real interest rates in the main emerging countries are still inappropriately low or even negative.

 

Stagflation is not here to stay. East Asia is unlikely to remain immune from current near-zero growth in Europe (to where it exports about 5 per cent of its GDP) or, even more, from forthcoming deterioration in the US (to where it exports almost 7 per cent of its GDP). Commodity prices have started to decline. However, the underlying issue will not go away, for two reasons.

 

First, lingering scarcity of fossil energy and agricultural commodities is likely to remain and to change the macroeconomic scene significantly. For about two decades, since the start of the current wave of globalisation, it seemed that there were no real speed limits to global growth. Dsinflationary forces coming from the increase in the global labour force and the weakening of organised labour were powerful enough to ensure an environment of low prices worldwide. This Goldilocks era has ended and the world economy is likely, over and again, to test the speed limit stemming from constraints on the supply of commodities.

 

Second, in the same way German unification revealed the fault lines in the European monetary arrangements of the 1980s, the current episode has exposed the fault lines in the so-called “Bretton Woods 2” arrangement, whereby a large part of the emerging world pegs to the US dollar. But for the direction of the shock (a boom then, a slump now), what is happening now is in many way a repetition of what happened then to the European exchange rate mechanism: here, a shock to the anchor country that desynchronises it from its monetary bedfellows.

 

So the question is: what do we need to manage interdependence better? A straightforward solution would be for the main countries or groupings to target domestic inflation independently in the context of flexible exchange rates. The proviso is that for such a solution to work participants would have to target total, not core, inflation (this may seem obvious but it has apparently escaped some policymakers, who claim that there is nothing they can do about inflation because it is not home-made). This is more or less the arrangement industrialised countries came to a decade or so after the collapse of Bretton Woods. It involves minimal co-ordination and can accommodate differences in preferences. In the European case, it has proved compatible with tighter regional agreements – including a single currency.

 

The problem is that a large part of the emerging world, starting with China, is not ready for independent floating. There are genuine obstacles to it, such as incomplete financial liberalisation and resistance stemming from the fear of uncontrolled appreciation. However, there is no reason why a preference for managing exchange rates should imply the status quo remains. Ad­justments are needed and the current de facto dollar pegs are often at odds with the countries’ foreign trade. From basket pegs involving currencies other than the dollar, especially the euro, to innovative solutions such as the commodity peg advocated by Jeffrey Frankel of Harvard, there is a large menu of options to choose from for reformers looking to strengthen domestic and world stability.

 

But with managed exchange rates comes closer policy interdependence. If they are to remain prevalent in one form or another, there will need to be more co-operation in setting reference rates and monitoring aggregate demand. This implies multilateral discussions on exchange rate arrangements as well as on domestic demand policies and domestic subsidies to oil and food consumption. From an institutional standpoint, this also implies going beyond the existing loose arrangements or mere lunch invitations such as the last G8 summit in Hokkaido. The G7/G8 is not the appropriate forum for macro-financial matters any more. A frank policy dialogue between emerging and developed countries requires an appropriate venue.

 

The one option that is not advisable is to ignore the lessons from this year. For some time now, globalisation has been increasingly difficult to sustain politically, in spite of having brought income gains and low prices to the citizens of the advanced economies. It will already be much harder to convince the same sceptical citizens that they must accept it despite the fact that it brings higher commodity prices and lower incomes. It would simply be impossible to make the case for it if, in addition, it were to be perceived as a source of enduring instability.

 

Exchange rate arrangements and their implications for global macro­economic management should thus be a priority topic for the international community and especially the International Monetary Fund. The Fund is looking for a renewed purpose; here is one that belongs to its core mission and where it has no substitute. Success, however, will only be possible if the G7 countries admit that the days when they were running the show are over.

 

The writer is director of Bruegel, the European think-tanki

[Steve Netwriter]

Guess it's not late Fri night in NZ

 

I am right certain of it the only real worry us gold investers have is that USD turns out to be OK.

 

No

 

A beautiful Sunny day.

 

I have a really bad cold, and am stuck inside feeling..........yuk

 

Have one for me

 

[njpurser]

GF you were asking some question on GIM about currencies and the Jim Sinclair ratio etc again from Jesse's this article from the FT thought you might find it interesting

The witer indicates CBs "ignored the effects of focusing on their local problems" as if commoditiy inflation and the effects on developing nations were not forseen.

 

Naiive twit.

 

Nick

[G0ldfinger]

Guess it's not late Fri night in NZ

 

I am right certain of it the only real worry us gold investers have is that USD turns out to be OK.

With $60tn in unfunded liabilities, I can't be too worried.

[G0ldfinger]

GF you were asking some question on GIM about currencies and the Jim Sinclair ratio etc again from Jesse's this article from the FT thought you might find it interesting

Cheers. I'lll read it tomorrow.

[Steve Netwriter]

With $60tn in unfunded liabilities, I can't be too worried.

 

Geez, I thought you meant personally for a minute :lol:

[Compounded]

No

 

A beautiful Sunny day.

 

I have a really bad cold, and am stuck inside feeling..........yuk

 

Have one for me

 

Dreadful summer here but it's been nice today - apart from the hailstorm with thunder this morning.

 

I think your basics on gold thread is brill, wish I had found something like it earlier.

 

Must have taken ages to do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Steve Netwriter]

Dreadful summer here but it's been nice today - apart from the hailstorm with thunder this morning.

 

I think your basics on gold thread is brill, wish I had found something like it earlier.

 

Must have taken ages to do.

 

Hailstorm :lol:

We better not get onto the weather. It's a pet topic of mine !

It started at about 13C indoors this morning. Now it's 25C

The snow on the mountains looks fab

 

Thanks. It didn't take that long. Somehow I just seemed to have things to write. And I have a huge store of links I keep, so I just raided that for the best bits.

 

I wish I'd found something like it before I had to write it :lol:

One problem is I don't always get time to read all of the things I make a note of

Still, they are there if I ever feel the need.

 

Here's a webcam at Lake Tekapo, so you can see the snow

http://www.tekapotourism.co.nz/webcam.htm

 

[Steve Netwriter]

Hyperinflation Special Report

 

April 8th, 2008

http://www.shadowstats.com/article/292

 

Inflationary Recession Is in Place

 

Banking Solvency Crisis Has Opened First Phase of Monetary Inflation

 

Hyperinflationary Depression Remains Likely As Early As 2010

 

The U.S. economy is in an intensifying inflationary recession that eventually will evolve into a hyperinflationary great depression. Hyperinflation could be experienced as early as 2010, if not before, and likely no more than a decade down the road. The U.S. government and Federal Reserve already have committed the system to this course through the easy politics of a bottomless pocketbook, the servicing of big-moneyed special interests, and gross mismanagement.

 

The U.S. has no way of avoiding a financial Armageddon...........

 

[Steve Netwriter]

I guess what I happened across just now ? Yes, M3 for NZ

 

The M3 figures for NZ from 1988 to 2008.

 

 

M3 has been fairly constant at about 7.74%/year.

 

(I would have used a log y axis, but I can't get the ticks close enough together to work out the slope easily.)

 

 

[notanewmember]

british bulls was right

 

 

......

[notanewmember]

Heres to a brighterday for Goldbugs

Goldbugs wont submitt

[wrongmove]

edit - wrong thread!

[lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)]

With $60tn in unfunded liabilities, I can't be too worried.

60 trillion - i think you can double it

 

link

 

According to Dallas Federal Reserve president, Richard Fisher, when these Medicare liabilities are added in with those for Social Security, the unfunded liabilities grow to $99.2 trillion. After adding in the direct debt obligations from its borrowings, the total government debt is $110 trillion, which is twice the amount reported in the government’s annual consolidated accounts. Here are some insightful excerpts from a speech given by Mr. Fisher in May. http://www.dallasfed.org/news/speeches/fis...08/fs080528.cfm

 

“Let me give you the unvarnished facts of our nation’s fiscal predicament.

 

[in the seven years ending in 2007], federal spending grew at a 6.2 percent nominal annual rate while receipts grew at only 3.5 percent.

 

The mathematics of the long-term outlook for entitlements, left unchanged, is nothing short of catastrophic.

 

Critics…begin by wringing their collective hands over the unfunded liabilities of Social Security.

 

The bad news is that Social Security is the lesser of our entitlement worries. It is but the tip of the unfunded liability iceberg. The much bigger concern is Medicare.

 

If you wanted to cover the unfunded liability of all [Medicare] programs today, you would be stuck with an $85.6 trillion bill.

 

For the existing unfunded liabilities to be covered in the end, someone must pay $99.2 trillion more or receive $99.2 trillion less than they have been currently promised.

 

We know from centuries of evidence in countless economies, from ancient Rome to today’s Zimbabwe, that running the printing press to pay off today’s bills leads to much worse problems later on. The inflation that results from the flood of money into the economy turns out to be far worse than the fiscal pain those countries hoped to avoid.”

It is noteworthy that Mr. Fisher mentions the experience of “countless economies, from ancient Rome to today’s Zimbabwe.” Though he doesn’t actually say it, the United States is headed for hyperinflation. Its debt obligations make that outcome certain, just like it did for those other countries with fiat currency.

 

To Top

 

The federal government will not cut back on spending. There is no political will to do that, and in any case there is no need for politicians to cut back in today’s monetary system. Because there is no external discipline imposed on the currency creation process as there was, for example, under the classic gold standard, its captive central bank, the Federal Reserve, will make certain that sufficient dollars will be created to meet every penny the federal government intends to spend. That is why the Federal Reserve exists – the Federal Reserve is there to make sure that the federal government’s budget deficits get funded just like the central bank funded the deficits of Weimar Germany in the 1920s or today’s government budget deficits in Zimbabwe which are being funded by that country’s central bank.

 

Do you think the Dallas Federal Reserve president is exaggerating? Federal Reserve presidents are not prone to HYPERBOLE and exaggeration. Do you think James Turk’s comment on government spending and the purpose of the Fed is inaccurate? My guess is NO. You can count on these things happening. Please keep in mind that FIAT G7, and all currencies for that matter, are backed by NOTHING, nothing but the full faith in government. Thus, they are redeemable in nothing but HOT air and YOUR property and holdings!

[stevecook172001]

Its a Cartel Secret! but they can cause unflatable unflation in unflated assets!

 

 

Here is a nice chart courtesy of the wonderfull Jesse's cafe of the dollar.

 

http://jessescrossroadscafe.blogspot.com/

 

 

thanks for the replies to the question steve. I'll take alook

[Wanderer]

:lol: :lol:

 

I think that deserves a little more prominence

 

 

:lol:

 

Steve N,

 

Who gave you access to my trading files? Aren't these things supposed to be private? I'm on to my lawyer....

 

Wanderer

[Wanderer]

http://www.ft.com/cms/84d2eba2-2a26-11dc-9...mp;fromSearch=n